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Wouldn't it be sadly ironic if we all turned down the $3500 and THAT turned out to be a better deal?

Agree. The Hartford settlement put the lie to there being billions more from carriers. Century Chubb will never pay more one an exposure basis than Hartford. Maybe a billion but that’s it. The Coalition is only in this for their own personal gain. The claimants aren’t stupid. Get BSA out of the equation and take aim at the others in state court where the balance of leverage shifts. It’s the only way to extract fair value which is on a state by state, council by council, CO by CO basis. 5.0 has no chance. If BSA was smart it would immediately revert to the toggle. Going forw

They will always couch it with "up to" "as high as", "prior victims got as much as". They cannot guarantee specific amounts or levels, but they can couch it. That's why the comment from one of the aggregators "Our target is at least $100,000". Sure it is. My target's the moon. Doesn't mean I have any reasonable chance of making it if I jump real high.

Not sure how that pertains to my post. Please explain.

Only if you’re in a state with no or a relaxed statute of limitations. in 24 states the Legislature is never ever going to lift that statute (due to state constitutional provisions that ban such look backs ). in the rest, maybe you get a victim or even a few dozen to sue the LC. Then the LC simply goes into its own Ch 11. Again, there is no scenario here where all victims across 50 states get 100% of claim values.

Bob Brady for FCR keeps saying the plan has "significant survivor support". No, there is significant LAWYER support. That does not automatically = survivor support.

The last time Finn didn't sign a mediator's report, there was a note as to why "Due to a previously scheduled conflict, Mr. Paul A. Finn was unable to attend today’s mediation sessions." https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/5f6aab30-8bb9-4ec6-870b-f4acfbf4e412_5284.pdf The fact that Finn did NOT have that footnote put in speaks volumes.

Yes, BSA is LYING about Dodgeball. The Ban went into effect in 2018, and even after the Dodgeball ban, you could still find Dodgeball and several variants on scouting.org website as recommended games.

That number is self-proclaimed by the Coalition and the BSA uses it to its benefit. Stang just went there...the Coalition wants this over because it stands to gain $400 million plus from settlements.

Here's the cake version for those lacking time to read Troop 709's story... Peter, who came from the farthest away (Charlotte, N.C.) cut the cake at perfect time… 7:09 p.m.

Curious take on your part considering many think you take on CO's is fringe/fanatic. Really, I have never hear of an IH that was not the head of the institution. But that does explain a great deal about your over zealous take on what a CO is.

And my follow up would be: Just how many were induced to join in filing a claim BECAUSE of the high dollars that were pitched? Perhaps if the dollars were more realistic to begin with, borderline claims may have never been filed, leaving the limited funds to be distributed to a smaller pool.

Some have said there's not fraud in this case, other than a limited area identified by that poster. I think that remains to be seen. If true, smells like fraudulent inducement to me. I have zippo words for how I feel as a human, never mind attorney and BSA child sexual abuse survivor, about what is being alleged by the insurers. If true, it's reprehensible.

Just curious: To you lawyer types..... Is it tantamount to legal malpractice to draw in clients with pitches of hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars when there may only be like $5k? It just seems so egregiously negligent. The wounds this has ripped open for everyone is a high price to pay for the way this has played out. It would not surprise me to hear that more than a couple of victims end up going over the edge. The whole thing is so disappointing. At this juncture, they might just as well approve the best terms and divide it up among valid claimants. Doesn't seem like th

But EVEN WITH those, I don't see how you reduce $30-$134 billion to only $2.1-$7 billion. And even if it is that low, why would a victim accept it when they were assured hundreds of thousands if not millions. Zalkin just said: he's thinking he can settle for millions NOW against Orange County Council and Hartford. Why on earth would he take this deal?

What you are missing is: SOL ... many of these claims are probably really $0 since they are outside SOL False claims ... BSA must be assuming some are false That said ... even then I expect the math doesn't add up.

The BSA's math doesn't add up. I think this is Stang's point. If I merge the data from Fifth Amended Plan pages 148-149 https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/010161cd-594e-4b9e-8c88-a7402b49cf4d_6212.pdf And Exhibit F of the Fifth Amended Plan https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/3fa71e64-3562-4885-99ea-d71178ab2f0f_6224.pdf Tier Type of Abuse Base Matrix Value Maximum Matrix Value Unique and Timely Abuse Claim Count by Allegation

I’m knackered of all of this.

This a bloody mess. (I use "bloody" as used in the Commonwealth.)

That by itself should be enough to vote no. Why should I share my LC’s contribution with someone who is getting money from the LDS pot that I can’t share in.

The reality is that this is for the benefit of the JUDGE. No one is assuming (correctly) that she is abreast of the issues. As well, she had a 12-hour hearing yesterday. So, this is the "sausage-making" part of bankruptcy. The devil is in the details and when a plan is going to get considered it is ALL details. We need to remember as well that there are professionals representing groups like the TCC and Coalition as well as members of those groups. Some of the members have precious little experience in bankruptcy court and unfortunately like to prove it sometimes!

Or it will be "$15,000 + additional recovery from insurance companies, maybe, someday in the future." Yeah, they aren't going to approve. You never get to 66% of most victims, who were lead to believe there was billions to be had and that they would be getting amounts closer to hunderds of thousands if not $1 million+ (USA Gymnastics, Catholic Dioceses, etc.) are instead looking at $15,000 and a pinky-promise of maybe more money some day.

I think the judge should tell everyone to spend the next few days, ready our 6 threads on the bankruptcy and only then can they talk in court. I'm serious ... some of these people are either intentionally lost OR they have no clue what is going on. For example, the Guam lawyer was surprised to hear that if this deal goes through no one can sue their local council for CSA prior to Feb 2020 (she may not even know that date). She had no clue about the first Hartford settlement. Come on people ... at least get up to speed.

BSA is very concerned here. Why? Because both they and Stang knows that when a claimant sees a valuation of their claim being $1.5M and if they vote yes on this deal, they can expect $15,000 ... guess how they will vote?

No kidding, I mean 80% of the things coming up in this hearing are things we've already hashed out here in these forums. I'm not saying we've gotten ANSWERS, but we've already talked about almost all of this.

It's the Master Ballot system. There are three related questions: 1) Are there agreements by claimants and attorneys that the attorneys have been hired to represent their interests? 2) Are there agreements by claimants to allow attorneys to vote on their behalf? 3) Are these documents one in the same? Courts have said they want very, very specific language that the attorney is authorized to vote. The rule is Rule 3018(c) “[w]here the voting process is managed almost entirely by proxy, it is reasonable to require a valid power of attorney for each ballot to ensu

@RememberSchiff ... Still a really cool achievement. Be proud.

Discovery must start and that can only start if she starts hearing on the plan. She doesn't see a benefit in a delay. More info isn't always better. She has some questions about the plan that she hopes to get answered this week. Another couple of weeks simply push this off, discussions must start now.

Judge: Two hours into this hearing. We need to start working on disclosure statement issues. Sensitive to timing of the filing of the documents and the time frame attorneys have had to review the documents. But, we need to start on the many objections already filed to find out what is remaining to 4th plan and then work on the objections to 5th plan. People have clearly read the documents. More information is not always best, we need salient information. I don't think adding more information is going to be the end of the information gathering. So we need to get to discovery. Motion to del

Feb 2021/June 2021 .... LC assets increased $80M.

It sounds like that will be a upcoming focus of discussion by the TCC.

Stang: The BSA ice cube may be melting, but the Local Councils are GROWING. This is a reference to the fact that many councils have MORE money than they did thanks to endowments growing due to the stock market.

Lawyer for Methodist/Catholics: There is no resolution and my clients do NOT support. It was never an agreement that was reached with COs (other than LDS). We need more time.

In general, quiz games have limited education value. But, building fun into the process is always good. Zombie fences, first aid meets, water rescue drills, land navigation to dead-drops of dinner/dessert ... these are the things that build scout skills.

Yes ... AND ... does that prevent them from suing the LDS if the CSA occurred during a non scouting activity.

Stang points out something I missed: only 2 out of 3 mediators signed the latest report. Finn did not. Why?

My job is going to keep me unable to live review the proceedings but I'm listening in.

I'm sorry but that's not a "Plan", it's a general idea on how they'd do things. Developing workable details on that "plan" aren't going to be any simpler than what we've already be doing for the last 2 years. You can't compare accidents with deliberate acts. It's far far simpler to prevent accidents than to stop someone from doing something deliberately. As far as your belief that "We're not doing everything we can"; well no, obviously we aren't doing everything we can. But "everything we can" isn't the standard we want to hit it's "everything we reasonably can". I mea

I think you get out of the OA what you put into it, like most things in life. If you view it as a chance to get a new patch for your uniform, then that's what it will be - a harder version of eBay. If you view it as a vehicle for networking with Scouts from other troops, you're likely to get more. If you take the time to sit down with the ceremonial texts, read them, and think about them, you'll understand that the organization is about servant leadership. As a youth, my chapter was small in number and large in geography. It wasn't super active simply because most of us didn't have transp

Hey, now. Don’t be dragging me down into your mud wrestling EIN racketeering scheme! (I’ve had way more than 15 minutes of incarceration on top of my fame and misfortune, by the by.)

Just came from a UMC leadership meeting. Several of us have alerts set if there is news this evening. Our suspicion is that it has been a late evening in Nashville trying to work out final details for tomorrow's hearing. I think that the intent had been to make a public statement this evening. Given the late hour, our first news from the UMC ad hoc committee may come at tomorrow's hearing followed by a public statement or an update of some sort. Still waiting to see if the Batphone rings tonight.

Or, it looks like buying a car. Maybe they're just haggling over a price. It looks to me both sides have threatened to walk away, and everyone knows that's bad for their side.

We have had 20 or so Girl Troops across the Council. My daughter was in both Troop and Crew at the same time. (so was my son). I would say the results have been mixed, just like Boy Troops. Some do well and some do not. Some observations of Troops I saw. Age distribution was very much a divide. The vast majority of the girls were with 11 or 12 (from Cubs or new) or they we 16 or 17 (coming from Crews) . Very few fell in the 13-15 age group. As a result there was a natural divide that made it difficult for some troops. Most of the Scoutmasters were females that came up th

I found the formatting of the screen and software objectional. It seem slipshot.

The concerns are there, but there is no pre 1975 history. Also, some orgs are "dam the torpedoes" types that are willing to shoulder the burden of risk.

Tonight was an example of our precarious situation. An hour before the meeting, the other family texted that they had a COVID symptoms case and weren't coming until the kid got tested. They tried to cancel everyone else, but I fixed that as quick as possible for most of them. Our guy who is becoming the Webelos DL also bailed for an unknown reason. We decided to put the kids in the ga ga ball pit and made it a parents meeting. We brought a laptop and set it up with a mobile hotspot. The parents who hadn't finished youth applications submitted them. The Tiger DL designee filed his applic

I am trying to not lose my temper at this remark. Parents can be predators. Predators are not limited to single men without kids. In fact, it is just as likely for a married person with kids to be a predator. Scout units should not let down their guard because someone has a kid in the unit. I cannot stress this enough.

I'm good with it. I have 30 years of scouting experience in one of the most violent storm states in the union. We've camped in zero degree weather as well as 110 degree weather. We have camped in more thunderstorm than I can count. Take the training and know what to do and you are good to go. Barry

Record making stuff? Probably never enters their minds. And if it does, that is also choice. My son had some friends in another troop who were famous for never wearing long pants. They always wore scout shorts, even in the coldest weather. I'm sure they some kind of record. I don't think this is that hard of an accomplishment. Our troop had a least one outing a month the whole time I was there. It wasn't about records, it was about adventure and activities. Patrol method needs a place to practice. Provide the place and the scouts will grow from practice. Very simple and it works. As

You did because it would have made some historical sense if you consider that Civics (1911-1946) became Citizenship (1947-1951) which splintered into Citizenship in the Community, Citizenship in the Nation and Citizenship in the World and Citizenship in the Home and World Brotherhood in 1951. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discontinued_merit_badges_(Boy_Scouts_of_America)