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This one puzzling aspect of the bankruptcy: time barred claims being given any consideration whatsoever. I don't believe that the bankruptcy judge can make time-barred claims viable again. If the SOL has expired, time-barred claims are barred, and that is it, that is, at least as a matter of judicial compulsion. Having no legal interest in the bankruptcy proceeding, they do not have standing, and should have no vote. (Hence, my belief that claims should be vetted for viability prior to any vote.) Insurance companies won't support any payment by them to time-barred claimants.

@RememberSchiff I was waiting for you to post this, you are a great news finder. However, thought I'd get the pulse of the list on this release from yesterday: https://www.scouts.ca/news-and-events/news/2021/09/scouts-canada-introduces-vaccination-requirement-for-all-members Link to the FAQ's at the bottom of the announcement. For those that have not seen it the BSA's current position can be found here: https://www.scouting.org/coronavirus/ "...We encourage everyone to consult with their physician and get vaccinated. It is our best hope for returning to normalcy in our Scou

Not sure if your comment was tongue in cheek...I hope it was. That same link says more than 600,000 died of the 1918 Flu (no longer PC to call it the "Spanish Flu"). I have a Masters in Public Health, a 40+ year career in various aspects of Public Health and my wife is an RN. Getting the jab was never a question and we stood in line as soon as we could secure an appointment. Wife just had her 3rd booster shot due to an immuno-suppressant medication she is taking. It knocked her for a loop for 2 days, unlike the first 2 doses which were no worse than the annual flu shot. We also got

Judge Likely to Rule for Boy Scouts in Trademark Case With Girl Scouts

Well, it just might be closer to 13.8% and explain why the TCC is saying "enough is enough" and coming out swinging. OK, for the data-geeks, a VERY deep dive on this gives additional perspective from a friendly accountant looking over my shoulder. His comment: The percentages in the summary appear to be mathematically correct based on the amounts reported by the BSA; however, it is important to remember that amounts reported in Exhibit 1 for “Land Buildings & Equipment” are book value. As a result, in most (if not all) cases the percentages calculated in the summary you shared are a

Technically, they didn't. What they did was sign "letters of intent": IF the BSA plan goes into effect and IF the LCs are covered by such a plan THEN the LCs will pay out. No plan that covers LCs, no money from the LCs.

BSA has 637 CSA claims 2010 and later. USA Gymnastics has a total of just over 500 claims.

Canada is also a completely different country. They are used to socialized medicine and while some segments will still fuss, it is not like here. Look at how quickly they went from 0% vaccinated to 70% plus once they had vaccine. I think all pressure should be brought to bear on all eligible people to be vaccinated through the means cited by Eagle1993 but I think BSA has to stick with its policy for now.

The largest gain as far as my life goes will be the realization thru this process that I am not the only one who was abused and I cannot continue my journey of life without help. I can definitely say I am in a much better space today then I was two years ago. I hope you are seeking the help that we all need and ultimately getting the financial compensation that we all deserve.

There is no moral equivalence between our US military possibly killing innocent people when targeting groups who are our enemy and the Ku Klux Klan who bombed churches because black people worship there. Take that crap somewhere else.

I'm 99% sure it was 40% which was mentioned in a TCC townhall. That is why I was shocked the Hartford settlement was so low. It really cuts the legs out of any real major payment to claimants. I wish BSA didn't have that initial Hartford settlement. Without that, I think this deal would be much closer to finalizing.

From what I understand ... many lawyers and claimants were told they could expect big payouts from insurance companies. Think $XB or even $XXB. What they are seeing from a major insurance company is <$1B ... which is making them reconsider and may then demand more money from other sources (LCs, BSA and COs).

It was always, always, always a hard legal sell as to why the LCs (who are neither debtors nor creditors in the BSA bankruptcy) should be able to use BSA's bankruptcy to solve or resolve claims against the LCs. That has been one of the longest running objections and one of the main ones lodged by the U.S. Trustee. If the LCs want to be protected from past claims, they should be filing their own bankruptcies, not trying to climb aboard BSA's. Why should a victim have his claims against the LCs voided/prohibited from going into state court if the LCs are not the ones in their own bankr

Nothing new that I can see: plan is wonderful, blah, blah save your objections for Confirmation, but this is new (or maybe I missed it) The Best Interests Test Does Not Apply to Non-Profit Debtors and, Even If It Does, It Cannot Be Determined at the Disclosure Statement Stage And BSA is making the case for why all claimants, even those in SoL states, should get a vote. The Temporary Allowance of Abuse Claims at $1.00 Solely for Voting Purposes Is Proper BSA is arguing, in effect, that giving $1 to EVERY claimant now is find since the settlement trustee can figure out the So

Section 1 is a lengthy discussion of why everything the insurers say is wrong, wrong, wrong in opposing the plan Section 2 amounts to "attorneys for lots of victims agreed to this deal, so let's make this deal happen" ("The Amended Plan and the TDP are the Product of Extensive Negotiations Between the Most Significant Stakeholders in the Chapter 11 Cases.") A key element: the Trustee will be allowed to permit claims outside the statute of limitations but subject them to an as yet undisclosed "scaling" factor (see page 22) They cite to TDP Art. VIII.E.(iii) which cites to "Schedule 1" w

ooops. proof reading failure is common in my family.... millions..... that 600,000. is American deaths (low estimate) only. corrected above entry. I apologize for the slip... here's a reference.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu

In the discussion I have been involved it is still up in the air, but... 2022 - is all but officially a no go. In part because the logistical wheels would need to be in full motion at this point and they are not. Could something be pulled together? Possibly, but it would be very high risk of failure. Secondly, it is also NOAC in 2022 which is already in full motion. 2023 - This is a possibility. First, the US contingent has a limited on how many can go to World Jamboree, but it is still likely several thousand. Second, the cost for South Korea will be several thousand dollars due to

And yet, was completely applicable in addressing the post you made.

I don't come to this forum as often as I used to, so I came to this post late. I have read much about what the OA is and is not here, some of it right and some wrong. First, the OA is not separate from the BSA, it is part of the BSA. And its mission is to support the BSA in achieving its mission. No, the OA, or even BSA, cannot force a unit to hold elections. But I think it is a poor reflection on those units that do not hold elections when they have eligible scouts. In some cases I find that it's a unit leader that does not understand what the OA is or what it can do fo

I fully agree with Scout Canada's vaccination decision for Canada. Canadians if not agreeable to restrictions and mandates are somewhat acclimated to months of work restrictions, travel restrictions, curfews, lockdowns at a level not approached here. It could work there, even the part where scout parents must be vaccinated. In the USA? We cannot agree to require vaccination of school children. Other than echoing government policy, what more can the BSA do? Some thoughts I think the BSA could implement a Scout Canada's policy at all their camps. If not, could 100% (confirmed) va

The COs I know that signed off on applications did so because they didn't know the people and unit leaders asked them to. They did so because they trusted the unit leaders.

This is a red herring. Having looked at the files, which have been public for a while now, the vast majority, dare I say 99+% of cases of abuse involved unit leaders that we selected and approved by the CO. Even recently, I have seen CO;s dig in for a fight when the council has rejected someone the CO has approved.

Like eradicating smallpox? @RichardB, I appreciate that you're asking. Unfortunately, this topic has been politicized and is pretty much toxic. I like the "encourage you to talk to your physician" approach. I'd also explicitly add that units can set their own standards. As much as people are afraid of losing membership over such a mandate, my council is losing quite a bit of membership due to the virus. My district has lost at least half of its packs since covid hit. People are limiting their contact with groups and scouts isn't that high a priority. Until this virus is under control

We can always do more. Always. ... BUT, it's not automatically negligent or liable or even bad if we are not doing everything we can. ... What is reasonable? YPT and the current structure seems like a good standard / expectation. Perhaps this is a different thread, but what is better? What is the next YPT improvement? I fear the next improvement and the next and the next will eventually destroy scouting and it's better to not have the organized youth program. The same reasoning can go for many youth organizations.

There is always a risk that down the line an appeal in the context of this bankruptcy to overturn the plan in FEDERAL COURT via a FEDERAL appeal could happen. That's why there's no chance of disbursements until after the appeals are exhausted. As for a suit against the LCs in STATE court, the idea is that under the bankruptcy plan ALL claims against the LC shift to the settlement trust. If someone walked into STATE court, the LC would point to the bankruptcy court's decision and order and say, under res judicata, that the LC's liability was terminated as determined by another court of com

USA Gynmastics hid / protected / ignored Nassar. Are you saying BSA hid / protected / ignored abusers since 2010? Are you saying BSA had a single abuser that victimized 500 people? I'm not willing to go there. Was mandatory reporting done? Was YPT followed? Did BSA shield the abusers? Was the same single abuser allowed to victimize 500 claims? As much as people want to hate BSA, they've done a lot for YPT in the last 20 years. A huge amount. This seems like a very different situation than USA Gymnastics.

Notice of Hearing on TCC's Motion to delay (at least 2 weeks) the September 21 hearing on the Plan 5.0. That hearing will take place at 10am. IF approved, the hearing on the Plan 5.0 will be delayed to some date the judge picks. IF rejected, we go straight into discussion of Plan 5.0 with a follow-up hearings on September 23. https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/1ec1ae95-cc39-4ccc-ba30-b48676e507c8_6238.pdf

Mandates, historically, have tended to backfire in the long run. BSA’s statement is better nuanced. Although it may leave room for spread in units/districts where members are avoiding vaccination for reasons other than an established personal risk for adverse reactions, we do no service to our nation for people to avoid scouting in order to shirk a mandate.

Very well laid out. Though I am time-barred, I can assure the court that I have only recently, as a result of THIS process, realized the psychological damage my abuser has caused in my life. I was always aware it had impacted me, but thought I could live with it. Only now have I realized just how damaged I am, as a result of the actions of my abuser. For all of these years, I have been going through the motions of living, being the tough guy and acting like I was ok. Divorces-everybody has them. Drinking-everybody does that. But at age 65, this case has made me aware that I am not

As far as LC's contribution, if they would come up with a plan where each LC gets to keep ONE camp and 6 months operating funds where everything else goes to the settlement I think it would fly with no problem. Get rid of council offices too. With technology today a central office is not necessary. Some staff could work out of the camp or from home.

As promised yesterday. In short, on average, most LCs are only putting up 17% of their total net assets into the fund. Total Net Assets as claimed by LCs and posted in the BSA Plan documents. Next I'll look at Total Assets. 17.10% Average 16.39% Median -165.96% Min (deficit - Gulf Coast) 0.86% Min (non-deficit - Rocky Mountain) 54.58% Max (Greater Yosemite) 3 # of councils with % greater than or equal to 50% 5 # of councils with % greater than or equal to 40% 24 # of councils with % greater than or equal to 30% 83 # of councils with % greate

Thanks, this is what I found. 1) August 16 https://www.pszjlaw.com/assets/htmldocuments/BSA Town Hall Transcript 8-16-21.pdf Stang: "Century has approximately 40 percent of the exposure on the abuse claims..." 2) May 13 https://www.pszjlaw.com/assets/htmldocuments/BSA Town Hall Transcript 5-13-21.pdf Stang: "Hartford is one of the two largest insurance carriers with the largest insurance risk in the case. And the BSA negotiated a settlement with Hartford, by which Hartford pays 650 million dollars on account of no less than 24,000 claims, and it, in effect, tears up the in

To quote Cheech & Chong, “my head is like a sieve,” but I believe it was that percentage limited to a specific timeframe, not all claims.

The only reason several of these firms choked down the RSA was because they were told "the big money is in the insurance companies". Now that BSA cut the Hartford deal 2.0, there is NO way the other insurers are going to pay one dime more than what Hartford paid.

@CynicalScouter That is clearly understood. It is possible that the TCC could oppose a deal that eventually gets voted upon and is approved. However, the TCC is a big opponent who, as has been pointed, might sway the judge's opinion. So the opposition is a significant obstacle unless some achievable increase in money will satisfy.

Keep in mind there is the TCC and then there are literally hundreds of law firms, including the AIS group including Kosnoff. There is no one answer here.

I think the TCC Plan will appeal to the judge who probably doesn’t care which plan gets BSA out of bankruptcy. The TCC plan is less problematic legally because it allows survivors to go back in to the tort system and get actual judgments which would be binding on the carriers. That’s where the true pressure points are. Plan 5.0 is cockamamie, rife with appeal issues and too cheap.

Putting on my moderator hat here. Those using scatological terms to describe plans need to stop. The lawyers are doing there job.

To my mind this is a crying shame. The OA greatly enhanced my understanding of how the Oath and Law were supposed to guide a scout through out his life. It also gave me a way to serve a larger scouting community than just my patrol or troop. As well as giving me ready access to other SPLs and JASMs when I needed to talk over an issue I was having with the new SM. Many a Brother in the Order has told me much the same over a drink or two. ( Out of uniform of course) It is a long established creed of the Order that an Arrow man's first obligation is to his troop and patrol. So perhaps th

Better give up everything from every institution you ever valued and every person you ever respected. Not much from the past withstands the scrutiny of the present. Ya know doctors used leeches and blood letting and celebrated healing when they say laudable pus (aka an infection). Choose almost any profession ... almost any institution ... and almost any individual and you can justify outrage. The past isn't perfect. It's just the past and how we got to where we are.

Confused by this. So if unit elections are out, how does a scout get into the Order?

@MGinLA, I agree with most of what you said but I did things slightly differently. I still ran the elections. First, I had a couple if scouts that did find their place in the OA and they never would have known about it if I hadn't run the elections. I agree with you that the scouts know more about the scouts than the adults and our elections were much more about character than popularity as the popular scouts took longer to get elected than the quiet, helpful scouts. That said, I can also see certain personalities, if there were enough scouts like that, that would turn it into a popularity con

Chief Scout Executive James E. West visited Houston in late January 1923. The following quotes are from Jan 23-24, 1923 Houston Chronicle articles. The Ku Klux Klan was very much in the national headlines. While he does not explicitly mention the Klan, I believe Mr. West's remarks which follow are directly aimed at the Klan. "At this time when the spirit of intolerance apparently is gaining such headway in the social life of this great American government I think it would be appropriate for every big daily newspaper in the United States to carry the 12th Scout Law in big headlines so

Ours just told us they will no longer charter units after this year..... The search begins

@SiouxRanger There is no one on this forum with the forum name “Just Ku Kluxin’ Around.” Most here would call that the title of the thread for this topic. To enlighten your historical knowledge a bit, “Just Ku Kluxin’ Around” was the title of a recurring column in the Klan’s Houston newspaper (1910s-1920s) “Colonel Mayfield’s Weekly.” The column reported on that week’s light-hearted, jovial Klan activities. An historical reference in the historical sub-forum seems entirely appropriate, but feel free to take umbrage if that helps to advance your own interests. Your descri