Jump to content

Leaderboard

Popular Content

Showing content with the highest reputation on 05/22/20 in Posts

  1. New Key 3....Hillicourt, Beard and Seton
    5 points
  2. The less we make it like school, the better. BSA also has this exceptionally obtuse notion that "management" is the identical thing to "leadership". I want to scream when I get district advancement people or Eagle coaches that like to harp at kids that "they need to show leadership on their project", meaning they better have 26 other scouts and umpteen adults helping. The leadership part is far bigger than the managing workers part- meeting with a beneficiary, finding out their needs, coming up with the plan how to meet those needs, how to finance it, and how to execute it. I'm far mor
    5 points
  3. I was thinking about this the other night. I strongly argue that most adult BSA volunteers share their time because they like being outdoors, in camps, at camp fires, on a river, hiking, etc. But, we want kids to be in it to learn leadership and character. I think that's a bit hypocritical. I strongly believe scouting shines when we are more like a camping club. Friends planning meals. Friends helping setup tents. Friends starting a camp fire and singing songs. Friends planning their next adventure. Oh, as a side benefit, they learn naturally learn leadership and character
    5 points
  4. Skeptic, well said. I myself have certainly engaged in some of these behaviors. Yes, I'd say there is a dose of schadenfreude running through these discussions. I'd chalk it up to this: many of us have been loyal to scouting for years. Decades for some. We've done our best to provide a program worthy of the founder's original vision. We've done this despite obstacles put before us by pros, mostly above the DE level, and vols that sit on high level boards. I don't think the upper management of the BSA has been as loyal. Not as loyal as the unit level folks. Despite feedback from
    4 points
  5. That seems bad. Especially with everything being semi-shutdown for 6 months, it’ll be really hard to justify another fee increase.
    4 points
  6. When those of us here on the forums gripe about Family Scouting, we aren't talking about girls, or families renting a campsite at camp outside of summer camp. We're talking about the BSA encouraging families to attend monthly troop outings. Most of us have seen it in our units, or others. It's normally a mess of helicopter parenting and demotivated youth. It breaks down the patrol method, and stifles team development and learning of self sufficiency. Nothing wrong with a parent coming along to volunteer or observe. I imagine the idea of having families camp at the summer camp while the p
    4 points
  7. Very true. I think upper management has to go. If this can be accomplished without liquidating BSA, that would be great. If not, then liquidating BSA might be the only good option. We can rebuild after a liquidation. WOSM isn't going to give up on having scouting in the USA.
    3 points
  8. Many here who never saw or participated in these "surveys" are eager to know more about them - who conducted, how many participated , demographics, questions asked, results,...
    3 points
  9. This posting will include known upcoming changes to the national structure (area, region and national levels). Some will be announced over the next 24 hours. For this posting, please focus on sharing and commenting on actual announcements and facts. National Executive Board. The membership of this large entity will be re-elected today as-is, with no new members. This is because bankruptcy is not the right time to bring in new people. Deal with the difficulty, get through bankruptcy and then make changes. Further, some of the best people will not want to join until after the crisi
    2 points
  10. My guess are council paid membership programs. I.E. scoutreach, restoring the village, etc.
    2 points
  11. In the video they state … "End youth programs at 18 and build a volunteer corp for adults at 18." I'll be interested to hear what that looks like and if we can leverage them as adult leaders. If so, that could be a win as I think we lose young adults who could serve as leaders. "Create membership category to allow families and individuals to join special programs developed by councils." Also looking to see what this would be. I'm curious what they meant by this statement.
    2 points
  12. We have lost a lot of respected Scouters over the past few years. Don't ask them for FOS, council Eagle/UoS luncheon, popcorn, etc. But they see you selling spaghetti dinner tickets for a troop fundraiser, they'll pay for dinners to be given to local first responders.
    2 points
  13. That's the beauty of the Council Service Fee, they are selling it by eliminating the Family FOS campaign. Not FOS mind you, just the campaign. Oh, and the fees for tent camping at council property, which were double the local state parks.
    2 points
  14. After long consideration, I've written my last FOS check. From now on any time or treasure I donate, as humble as it may be, will be in support of local units only.
    2 points
  15. Wait. You mean there was no program silo? I guess making one is good news. This means nothing to me. This is just org chart stuff from my perspective. My question is how will my council be kept honest. If national is smaller along with regions and areas, then my council will have even less oversight. I'd like to say this is good but it just isn't. There is currently nothing to keep my council accountable to its customers. I don't see how this change improves anything.
    2 points
  16. I am a natural skeptic, and I take only about 10 percent of what I see on these pages as something to more than peruse. Having been on this board longer than most, I watched the drama between a number of posters that became sometimes almost abusive, and often hard to fathom or believe. The tendency of too many of us, and I am sure I have so exhibited at times, is to become bull headed and not willing to "listen" and "consider". This in turn leads to stalemates and often jaded attitudes and eventually to lack of involvement. But it also often becomes a crusade by the few, the ones that are
    2 points
  17. Yes. Even in a crisis, they do somehow manage to keep a focus on their priorities.
    2 points
  18. I don't believe that it is the purpose of Congress to step in and buy assets or property that would be primarily for the benefit of any particular business or non-profit org. The government already owns enough property that could be utilized if that were the case. As a taxpayer, if the government bought the properties, I'd want them opened up for public access, not kept nearly exclusively for the use of any particular private group.
    2 points
  19. I'm appreciative of how it is working for you. And, that is how we handle it as well. The big problem is just the use of the term Family Scouting. Drop the 'Family'- it is just Scouting, and that moniker just seems to have invited a bit of the ignoring the second word in the two phrases for a few in the past year from what I have heard from other unit leaders in my district.
    2 points
  20. Several messages got me thinking, but here are 2 of them. I hope there's enough flexibility to get more input from the parents as to what they really want for their kids. To me, the current program seems tailored to a narrow slice of society: The BSA is targeting parents that were scouts in their youth, those that want to camp every month, and those that want to advance. But I can see other parents that just don't understand this program. A lot of parents want their kids to be responsible and able to take care of themselves, to solve their own problems and own their own decis
    2 points
  21. I find myself wondering where are all the "champions" or "connected" supporters of Scouting at this point? Those people that call on BSA to be on hand for public events; those people that reach out to BSA for service and that benefit from all the Eagle and other projects? Where are the loud braggart pols that line their public image with their support of Scouting or even that they were or are Scouters or Eagles? Where are the legal experts that should be able to combat the overreach of the lawyers that only want to grow rich off the mistakes of a group that has given so much to our society
    2 points
  22. This will require significant training of parents to not interfere by "stopping by to visit" or "bringing treats", etc... As it stands, parents are allowed to view all program, so nothing bars them from interference except training them to not interfere. But I suspect, that is truly what many parents want (b/c they do not understand the real purpose of Scouts) so to suggest program will not change is folly.
    2 points
  23. My daughter and her friends were in Venturing primarily for the outdoor program. They have that now in Troops. Most young men I have spoken with were in Venturing for the outdoor program, to get away from "babysitting" in Troops, to leave the advancement program behind, and for girls 😜 With the young women leaving for Troops, many young men are bailing out.
    2 points
  24. I agree that we must keep a stiff upper lip, but this is wholly unfair. BSA has been a huge net positive. BSA had a youth protection program in place years before others. BSA did the best to track and remove violators before society and police had similar structures. BSA is being uniquely targeted because of assets without parallel targeting of structures with similar assets that had arguably statistically similar abuse history: schools. sports. and almost every single youth serving organization. BSA is being targeted using 2020 standards / expectations / judgement that were not existi
    2 points
  25. 1 point
  26. I think Area directors are where they put pros while they either wait for a SE position in a metro council, or place a lousy SE until they retire. The AD when I was a pro ended up a metro SE a few years later. And my lousy SE ended up being an AD until he retired.
    1 point
  27. It's this line of thinking by legal counsel that got me thinking about BSA trademarks yesterday. If everything gets liquidated, I could foresee a wealthy individual who is anti-BSA buying the Eagle Scout TM. Then they'd hold on to it, not using it themselves, and but granting anyone else the right to use it either.
    1 point
  28. I too hope the young adults are offered meaningful roles. It would be a shame to run them off by not giving them any responsibility. "Special programs"...this sounds suspiciously like the BSA's failed attempt at soccer. Perhaps it's another attempt to gain dollars and membership without the youth participating in traditional scouting. Of course, the problem with things like BSA soccer is that other organizations are already offer programs, and do so in a more efficient manner.
    1 point
  29. Seriously? $66? For what purpose, to be paid over during the settlement? I've been thinking about my FOS contributions. If the organization is going to go bankrupt and slimmed down, where will that money be going? The settlement fund?
    1 point
  30. Regions + Areas = Mutual Admiration Societies (MAS) MAS = zero value to units
    1 point
  31. Actually the lead lawyer stated in an NPR interview on the Diane Rheem (sp) Show that he wants the BSA dissolved . It is towards the end of the interview, and if you end early, you miss it.
    1 point
  32. The big talk right now is fees going up to $66 in August. Honestly, they could've raised it 1 cent and you will see an exodus just based on principle.
    1 point
  33. @Cburkhardt, thank you for the insights The initiatives are sound but a phrase keeps ringing through my head: "Too little, too late."
    1 point
  34. Raising dues last year was a deal breaker for many. Folks in the field didn't like it and said so. Too many financially struggling families. National's response: "Sell more popcorn." Those three words from a "commissioned BSA professional" will go down in scouting history, akin to the equally infamous "Let them eat cake." If the BSA was a sinking ship, the pros in Irving would be figuring out ways to charge people for PFDs and seats in lifeboats, how to bring more seawater aboard, and as the final waters swept across the deck, they'd present each other medals for a job well
    1 point
  35. Please share. I'd love to be on these things. Maybe it's just the Covid-19 hangover, but this is like the high drama spectacle to see right now I think!
    1 point
  36. Great. There's another lawsuit against BSA.
    1 point
  37. You are right, helicopters have been around for a while. But as I said previously it is the term "FAMILY SCOUTING" is the problem, not girls in Scouting. The general population equates "Family Scouting" to "Family Camping," and not "brothers and sisters" in Scouting. BSA has advertised as Scouting for the whole family, and for the general public that includes adults. And BSA has not helped matters. Do you remember the Scouting Magazine issue dedicated to family camping? Do you remember that the ages of the children were SCOUTS BSA aged youth? That was a major mixed message. And I am seeing mo
    1 point
  38. I am an optimist and view things quite directly and simply. There are very lengthy and detailed discussions about the addition of female members and the concept of "Family Scouting" that anyone on this site can go back and read. I carefully followed the debate and read the surveys that were widely distributed back then and was convinced that admitting siblings who were girls into separate Troops was the right way to go. I'm not going to go back and re-discuss that content, other than to say it was very convincing and made common sense. The Family Scouting policy did not change one word
    1 point
  39. I will concur with you. Here is the real problem of the narrative to me- Boy Scouts (Scouts BSA) is about the youth running things, so what the parents want is not the opinion that should be the main opinion. While you would never get 100% response on any survey, you still should be asking them, as THEY are the customer, not mom and dads checkbook. if it means a smaller organization sticking to the core fundamental of youth led, for me, so be it.
    1 point
  40. I wonder what the 18-20 year old ASMs think would be best since they are the future.
    1 point
  41. 1 point
  42. Hmm, Actually my comments were more towards the older scouts attitude of babysitting, but I do also believe advancement or Eagle heavy programs also drive a lot of older scouts out. I found that most Eagle heavy type programs have an average older scout age of 14. Now I can't say how girl troops fit with my observations of boys, there are a lot of unknown variables there including that girls are different than boys. But I can say that less than 5 percent of the scouts in my troop were specifically in it for the Eagle. And, if the Eagle was the primary motivation, they eventually left
    1 point
  43. "WHAT IF OUR UNIT DOES NOT FILL/OVERFLOWS THE CAMPSITE WE HAVE CHOSEN? We understand that many units have a favorite campsite. Campsite capacities are determined based on location, available equipment, an impact on the environment among other things. It is important that we follow the set site capacities. If a unit does not completely fill their chosen site, it must be understood that another unit may be placed in the same campsite so as many Scouts are given a camp opportunity as possible. If a unit overflows their chosen campsite, they may be reassigned to a campsite that will
    1 point
  44. Who is babysitting who! Doesn't matter, if babysitting is a word being used in your unit, they they are doing it wrong. And why would girls leave venturing for troops? If the boys are leaving because of babysitting, what is the attraction for girls? The unit leaders are doing it wrong. Chuckhardt has never hid his Troop's purpose of earning Eagles, but I know from experience that once the shininess of the Eagle wears off, the program better have something else. That something else is where the BSA will live or die in the future. Our troop when I was an active leader had the largest g
    1 point
  45. We need to change. Even without the lawsuits and bankruptcy, we need to change. We're going the way of bowling alleys right now. I'm 50 and as a kid, I lived in a bowling alley. It was tough getting a open lane at times. People belonged to leagues. Since then, society changed and belonging to a league is not something people want to do. We can't be nostalgic. We have to figure out how we can serve today's youth. Lots of people think they have the answers. I don't claim to know who has the right answers. I suspect adults younger than me with younger kids will know better than people 50 -
    1 point
  46. Maybe the lack of mBs and no dining halls will allow scouts to have a real summer camp as described by BP instead of simply "living under canvas".
    1 point
  47. I believe it was probably a Grumman or AlumiCraft, and I would bet that the beam (at the widest point) was 35-38", which is pretty standard for boat of this lenght (any similar lengthed vessel with a 24" beam would be extremely unstable and I cannot imagine this boat as a safe rental). Regardless, one of our committee members has a Grumman, probably a 20 year old canoe, with not a scratch or dent and still shiney. This is due to good care. Another of our committee memebers has a kevlar canoe, which is very strong and weighs 40-50% less than the Grumman. I have another friend with an
    1 point
  48. Before I can make a judgment about the GA state park experience, I'd need to know if those were Grummans or something else like AlumiCraft. From your description of the beam I doubt it...sounds kind of narrow. As for sitting in the floor of the canoe, you can greatly improve stability and control by kneeling on the floor with feet slid under the seat and merely leaning with your butt against the front of the seat. This tends to cramp your legs after while but it lowers the center of gravity and gives you the ability to control the canoe with your knees. I put pads down to reduce abrasion. On m
    1 point
×
×
  • Create New...