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Showing content with the highest reputation on 11/19/19 in Posts

  1. Gotta wonder, will the (new) OA open casinos at Philmont and Summit?
    5 points
  2. Much of your information is incorrect, and I must take a moment to clarify the false allegations of this post. Clearly you have a vendetta against our people, so I must as a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints counter your claims so that the facts can be weighed to the benefit of the members here and the discussion at hand. We have a PROFOUND respect for the separation of church and state - but that idea is not, as some might assume, the right of the state to prohibit religions from taking political stand on issues that have moral and civil ramifications. You need to stud
    4 points
  3. I hope and pray my thoughts here will be articulated in a way that will generate a positive response and greater unity of understanding and discourse by those who read it. I notice that the impending separation of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Boy Scouts of America has garnered much discussion about the motivations, ideology and mechanics behind this process. However, as I member of that faith, I also see that there has been an unfortunate trend by some to use this as an opportunity to make sideway comments voicing their opinions about our beliefs, our organizati
    3 points
  4. What many miss in this discussion is that it's not a question of sexual ethics, it's a question of equality. A growing number of people today have reached the conclusion that neither sexual preference and gender identity are questions of choice - they are part of who we are. So, more and more people were reaching the conclusion that the BSA was discriminating in it's membership based on factors not in the control of the individual. Further, sexual preference and gender identity are separate topics. I've seen youth we historically would label a boy go through Scouting who clearly identi
    3 points
  5. Why does this disease that everything has to be bigger, better, blingy-er always infect organizations? Instead of Bechtel, BSA could have done so much more good if it had developed a program to help retain Council level camps and properties on a regional basis. Property management expertise, help in setting up regional joint purchasing agreements to maximize cost efficiencies, marketing help, seed money to help transition some holdings into public ownership rather than being lost to sale and development. We are not scouts if we can't get kids outside. We are losing too many council camp proper
    3 points
  6. For the life of me, where does a families permissive or non-permissive sexual ethic come into BSA? I do not equate being an inclusive organization as being a reflection of any sexual ethic.
    3 points
  7. "With the 2013 Indonesian Education Curriculum in effect, it is compulsory for all Indonesian students to join the scout movement as scouting is officially one of the study units in the curriculum." Thank you Wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerakan_Pramuka_Indonesia
    2 points
  8. 2 points
  9. And hence, too much kool-aid drinking. I hope it's someone that can sell a lot of popcorn. I'm hoping Chapter 11 will force that change. Time to drain the kool-aid, so to speak.
    2 points
  10. Sadly they (BSA National) does not seem to look for outside talent. You have to be part of the club, raised in the club, dedicated to the club, in order to be anointed to run the club. Likely some of the issues with finance and direction, currently impacting the organization, may have been lessened if leaders with some outside experience and different professional path had been in charge.
    2 points
  11. First, thread title edited. second, my late Dad was a CPA. When he discovered businesses were borrowing for operating funds instead of capital growth, he’d get out of any positions he held in them forthwith. I pray the National Council does not need these funds for operating revenues. If they do, BSA is on some form of borrowed time.
    2 points
  12. Boy Scouts do service projects. They put in time for most of their rank advancements, and when they get to Eagle, they are expected to come up with a good project on their own and lead other scouts in getting it done. Hornaday awards also require big projects --- most are even more involved than Eagle projects. The Hornaday projects focus on environmental problems. Many troops also do service projects simply because its part of the scouting DNA. I thought it might be nice to put together a few pointers to media articles that cover some of these service projects. They help put scouting in
    1 point
  13. A Coast Guard Auxiliary Flotilla was the Chartered Organization for my Ship in 1970's suburban Chicago. I earned Quartermaster in what can only be described as a splendid Scouting unit. The Auxiliary members were our adult unit leaders. Sea Scouts (called "Sea Explorers" for a brief period of time when temporarily combined with the Exploring program) and the Auxiliary was a perfect program combination then and can be again on a national basis. Most of our Sea Scout alumni joined that Auxiliary Flotilla and became its source of new membership -- I think we had the youngest average age for a
    1 point
  14. What you call a rule change and not standing on principle, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints calls "Continuous Revelation." I'd call it changing with the tides. LDS Church rule change on baptisms reverses 2015 'revelation' in midst of era of change https://kutv.com/news/local/lds-church-rules-change-reverses-2015-revelation 20 changes the new Mormon president has made to appeal to Millennials and Generation Z https://religionnews.com/2019/06/18/20-changes-the-new-mormon-president-has-made-to-appeal-to-millennials-and-generation-z/ One w
    1 point
  15. Exactly right! So if you're thinking you need a shower, go jump in a lake! (Just don't lather up when you're in or near the water.)
    1 point
  16. The change to include reference to the mortgage is nowhere near significant enough for inclusion in the opening paragraph. It will be at the minimum moved to a blurb at the end, but more likely deleted. The Wiki admins don't mess around.
    1 point
  17. I have always viewed the problem as some chartering organizations used their pull to have BSA conform to these COs beliefs and doctrine which then forced other COs who did not have those same beliefs to exclude members they would otherwise allow. To use an analogy, many religious based COs believe the eating of pork is a sin, and thus violates their moral code. I argue it would not be appropriate for those COs to dictate that BSA prohibit bacon and/or exclude from membership those who eat it. It is entirely appropriate for the CO to not have bacon at their functions. Sure this seem
    1 point
  18. It was updated yesterday. Then deleted today as false information. The updated again. Wikipedia is fast.... Note that it is being edited by a user that was created 3 days ago and these are their only edits. Not stating it is false, but where this is included is clunky in the report so I expect more experienced Wiki users will continue to edit.
    1 point
  19. @ParkMan, your first scentence contradicts the remainder of your reply. You say this issue is about some higher ideal, "equality", but then every example you put forward is an example of permissive sexual ethics, and you conclude with the biased judgment that BSA picked "the wrong side" in the late 80s. The promoters of restrictive sexual ethics continue to argue that BSA is choosing the wrong side now. They flourish in their domains. And here is where I especially disagree with you ... I encourage anyone, of any particular faction, in any particular role (leader, follower) t
    1 point
  20. This whole thread was started because some high ranking person in the LDS church made the statement that: I wish the LDS church all the best in their new youth program. Now that they've left, I'd encourage church leaders to stop talking about the BSA and move on. Yep - guess the BSA just got caught up in that new fangled idea of the worth of the individual. I'm quite comfortable that the BSA left the LDS church because the restrictions it placed on the BSA were causing too many other issues. I'm glad the BSA for once stopped pandering and chasing membership.
    1 point
  21. If you think we perceive men and women as unequal, then you are grossly misinformed as to what we believe about the divine nature of both men and women, and it would do you well to study your words before putting false accusations online. I worry you may have many incorrect perceptions about our faith which I would be happy to discuss at any time. However, this forum is not an appropriate place for you to express your opinions about our doctrines and beliefs.
    1 point
  22. Here is a bit more info about it: https://seascout.org/news/auxscout-is-here/?fbclid=IwAR0nQRuc6iqFINcCwpSl1SBQh9JbfzUpTkab0EIBett_OQR2HFLPlYl5dkQ
    1 point
  23. Yep, this has been in the works for a while now. It is a very good thing. The CG Auxillary has a lot of excellent training and resources to help the youth and scouters in the program. There are now a lot of older experienced mariners that will be able and willing to teach the youth excellent skills. It really isn't about Coast Guard itself. USCG Auxillary is a seperate entity than the CG.
    1 point
  24. Problem is, traditional Scouting, in the sense of the Outdoor Program, was down-graded before today's typical Scoutmasters were born. So even those with experience as Scouts experienced a watered-down version. The typical Scoutmaster lasts less than a year. Through training, they had a shot at learning what is no longer in the literature - exciting outdoor program and the Patrol Method, our "essential method." The time allocated to training unit adults has been sharply reduced over years since the "improved Scouting Program" savaged our youth AND adult membership numbers. What w
    1 point
  25. Sadly I am reminded of events in the Colonial Virginia Council. They sold Camp Chickahominy and mortgaged their scout office to pay for Bayport Scout Reserve, which was supposed to be a Premier Scout facility. They couldn't make payments on Bayport, so it was foreclosed and they had to move out of their scout office.
    1 point
  26. ...and if our units are struggling financially, National wants us to "sell more popcorn."
    1 point
  27. Sadly it has been ongoing for a while. This really stems from several items 1) The cost for the Summit, this is a huge drain 2) Pension Liabilities that are not fully funded for the professional Scouts 3) General overhead not full contracted for current size of the organization 4) Sub part of the that is the current Council Structure may not be the best to deliver Scouting to the local community 5) General Medical Health Care costs, actually this impacts pretty much every business and organization 6) The liability portion (not abuse cases) that are more prevalent
    1 point
  28. I don't think one could disagree with this statement: “The reality there is we didn’t really leave them; they kind of left us,” said M. Russell Ballard, acting president of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. “The direction they were going was not consistent to what we feel our youth need to have ... to survive in the world that lies ahead for them.” One could certainly argue whether they agree with stated positions of the Mormon Church, but they are what they are. Fact is the BSA has made changes in membership requirements. The BSA felt they needed to make changes to be more
    1 point
  29. Agreed. It often felt like a square peg for a round hole. Never really fully matching. It was more LDS used BSA as a youth program as the program was 70% matching. It seems more a left-over relationship from the 1920s-1960s. But as society evolved, the LDS faith development program needed something else. I don't view it as LDS strong arming or BSA leaving LDS. Rather, society changed. LDS could have chosen to use BSA within the context of LDS but instead decided it was finally time to create their own branded youth faith development program. It may have a huge financial impa
    1 point
  30. That ought to cover exec salaries for another what, five years?
    1 point
  31. Then they probably should have consulted a real-estate attorney to explain it to them instead of publishing a story they don't understand. This transaction appears to be nothing more than updating and increasing the Line of Credit that BSA has been able to draw upon (with Philmont being the collateral) since 2010.
    1 point
  32. I'll have to disagree....When it comes to the social agenda, the Mormon Church has never respected separation of church and state. This course of action that the Mormon hierarchy decided to pursue was purely punitive, their original intent was to force BSA to back down from social changes that they strongly disagreed with. Recall Prop 8, California's Equal Rights amendment where the Mormon church illegally used the pulpit and deceptively named grassroots groups to enlist supporters against the amendment. It should be obvious that the Mormon church placed the BSA in a no win situation... to e
    1 point
  33. I like to tell my scouts the story of the only time I've put someone in the recovery position for real, the moral of the story being don't make any assumptions. It was about 15 years ago now. It was late in the evening and myself and Mrs Cambridge Skip wrere walking home when we came a cross a man slumped on his hands and knees in the gutter. It was a busy road so we helped him onto the pavement. He was very unsteady on his feet and sluring his speach to the point that he was incomprehensible. We were also right outside a pub. Our assumption (and we all know what that is the mother of!)
    1 point
  34. Flying? When I was maybe 6(?) dad and I went on a 'guy" day out to the Frederick County Fair. I saw a helicopter land in the big field, and being crazy about airplanes, we went over to see it. I found out later it was a Bell H47G, with the big plexi glass cover for the pilot. For a price, you could go for a ride ! Dad and I strapped in, and man, I still remember that ride ! Unfortunately, my poor eyesight kept me away from a pilot's license, but aviation still became important to me...… Help that young aviatrix learn to fly the REAL way.... Lift, Thrust, Drag,,,, Gravity she al
    1 point
  35. I was one of those who was indifferent about the OA scene due to time constraints and other issues. Over time due to arm twisting, I became more involved, and so has my son. Yes, there are youth that should not be there, and are troublemakers, but it is no sin to rally the troops, and encourage youth and adults to serve. We should be reminded that the chief goal of scouting is to develop young men into engaged citizens and leaders of the future. Being tapped is not an award for the self involved overachievers, but a call to service. Relationships and strengthening the bonds of brotherhood
    1 point
  36. Yes - but politics has a different dynamic. In an election there is a definitive winner. So, since we live in a primarily two party system it becomes a binary choice. So, appealing to the core constituency of one of those two choices is generally a good thing. In Scouting, there's not such a stark choice. The vast majority of available kids do not join Scouting. Further, there is not one political constituency in Scouting. I live in a pretty progressive, secular area. What matters to families in our area is very different than in others. Frankly - the BSA made a huge mistake eve
    1 point
  37. I actually see this as a positive reference to Boy Scouts. They specifically call out participation in Boy Scouts because it is so counter to the message and the respect that is afforded Boy Scouts. there is too much negative publicity because of abuses by Boy Scout leaders. But despite that, the public perception of youth in Boy Scouts remains very positive. This entire event is sad and occurs way too often. But the references to Boy Scouts is all positive.
    1 point
  38. 1 point
  39. So at a quick glance of OP document, this is rob Philmont to pay Bechtel?
    0 points
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