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Showing content with the highest reputation on 10/17/19 in all areas

  1. 4 points
    I'm also rural. When folks look at the cost scouting I'd argue they aren't comparing it to other youth programs, but rather a cart of groceries or tanks of gas to heat the house.
  2. 4 points
    I live in a rural area as well. There aren't many deep pockets around these here parts. Those with resources are bombarded with requests from well-meaning organizations in need of funds. Our community is generous but folks are financially fatigued, in every sense of the phrase.
  3. 3 points
    Wow, wow, wow, another price increase. I think it's pretty obvious that the BSA is not doing very well as an orgination managed by a central entity. It would appear that many many negative influences have risen up and the BSA is having a hard time dealing with them. I see that it has become very corporate and has lost focus on why people join scouting and why they stay around. At this time of the year the big focus is on growth and developing new units. Then popcorn season, .......and the cycle continues. I would suggest that the BSA think about an entirely different approach. Restructure from the top down. Look at the salaries of the senior executive staff, look at property holdings, look at programs that are not universaly productive, and support what they have and not worry so much about what we want to have. Scouting is changing but it just doesn't have "the draw" that it had when I was a boy; my two sons, both Eagles, dont have the interest that I have; and my grandson, who has to finish his eagle project, has even less interest. It may be that, like so many successful business, the BSA has overextended and just can't make the money needed to sustain it's assets. It may be that thay are having trouble with competing markets. It may be that they underestimated the impact of recent, controversial decisions. It may be that they overpriced themselves to the point that people dont think the product is worth the price anymore. Or, sadly it may be that the business of scouting, along with its values, standards, activities, adventure, oppertunities, and traditions, has simply run it's course like so many extinct organizations. (Gimbles, Wanamakers, JC Penny, Woolworths, Packard, Hudson, D.A.R.E., Dacor, U.S. Divers, Bob's Candy, and this list could go on for pages). I really think that people with a better prospective on business then I have, should reevaluate this whole thing from top to bottom, bottom to tob, and every angle, and reorganize the whole thing and try to save what we have.........before the whole show disappears completely.
  4. 3 points
    I am not involved in any other activities at school, nor is my wife. The bargain argument of other activities is not relevant to leaders who are looking at a significant increase. From my perspective its not a matter of what it costs my Scout. It will impact our entire family since we are all registered. Right now at $33 we are looking at $132 for all 4 of us, IF they go to $100 a year then we are talking $400 just for National fees before anything else is factored in.
  5. 3 points
    This whole waiting game national is playing has been a huge stressor for our Troop. I get it, BSA is getting hammered on insurance costs. But what about us poor, rural folks trying to keep a program going on an already shoestring budget? If our Council exec doesn't give a damn, I guess I should expect nothing more from a guy in Dallas make 500 grand a year...
  6. 3 points
    I think a lot about the movie "Follow Me Boys". Whether it was historically accurate or not, it reminds me that Scouting is really about the youth experience. When I was a kid, I knew councils & national existed - but they were irrelevant to me. In my decade Scouting, most of it has been as either a Cubmaster or Troop Committee Chair. In those experiences, I've never really worried about what the council or national thinks or wants. Both of those groups are really just here to provide me support as I run my program. I want to write a sticky post for this forum that says "Remember - units are in charge." The council and national are NOT higher headquarters (to use your phrase)and they are NOT in charge. They are in essence a franchise system that provides you a program and resources to help you implement that program. This is why many council scouters I know talk about the inverted pyramid model The unit is at the top of the organization chart. The rest - districts, councils, & national are here to provide you support. Now, that doesn't mean that those groups don't have goals - sure they do. They all have employees and budgets. They want to see Scouting grow and have money available to do interesting things (like have council camps). Councils will always ask you for money, they will always encourage you to recruit. Further, national is going to impose rules to keep the program uniform. National is also going to create rules to satisfy the underwriters of their insurance program. Yes, we often live at the intersection point of this. But, I would encourage you to put that in context. First and foremost it's all about unit leaders bringing Scouting to youth. I would encourage you to devote only an hour or two a month to worrying about council & national. Don't let your frustration with them get in the way of what's important.
  7. 2 points
    Last cost increase was approx 50% I am hearing everything from $50 to $125 now, which is 51% to 378% increase, with one council anticipating a 300% increase. That is not chump change for some families with 1 person involved, let alone those families with multiple registered. There are families in my area, long time Scouting families I might add, that are looking at alternatives.
  8. 2 points
    or clothes for work/school, doctor's visits....
  9. 2 points
    Those are fees I've never minded paying....
  10. 2 points
    I spoke with my attorney and he told me that this document is too broad and open ended. I am ok with criminal background checks but this appears to be an agreement allowing the BSA and their employees to look into every aspect and area of my private life (my attorney agrees). I plan to make several pen changes, and have that form notarized before turning it in. I also dont like the idea of them sharing information. I'm a retired Marine and law enforcement officer and held a final top secret security clearance so clearly I have nothing to hide. But I dont think that the BSA should have access to all of my private information.
  11. 2 points
    I know not quite the question you're asking, but... I'd plan a fundraiser. Even if the BSA fees doubled (or tripled), I think it is still payable. I also do not think the services of the BSA national organization warrant such a fee. However, I think that the overall value I get from being involved with the BSA is significant. I think it will be a harder to recruit into these other organizations and question their ability to provide a similar level of infrastructure to the youth I serve. So while they me be more economical, I don't think I'd jump over the amounts being discussed.
  12. 1 point
    This was in my news fed this morning https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/10/15/girls-boy-scouts-eagle-scout/
  13. 1 point
    Now there's some cash outlay....golfing. $500 for clubs (yeah I know cheap set), $50 for green fees, $20 for a dozen balls...not to mention fees at the 19th hole
  14. 1 point
    I don't expect the same here. A Cub Scout program today costs about $80 a year on average here. This includes $33 a year for BSA dues. The average family spends another $60 on a uniform every few years. The probably add another $120 to pay for camping trips ($20 per person for Scout & parent twice a year). This nets about $200 a year for Cub Scouts in my area. A Scouts BSA program costs about $80 a year on average here (including National dues). The same family spends about $100 on a uniform every few years. They add about $300 for summer camp and add another $200 for camping trips ($25 per Scout 8 times a year). This nets about $580 a year for Scouts BSA in my area. Of course, add in high adventure and this goes up quickly. If the BSA dues double that add $33 a year to the fee. I don't see many Cub Scout families dropping because that $200 now turns into $233. I don't see many Scouts BSA families dropping because that $580 now turns into $613. Maybe I'm wrong - but I don't think so.
  15. 1 point
    I am pushing oldest to finish Eagle before Dec 31st. Hopefully after this weekend, 1 MB left and BOR. Depending on the fee, an if I can get aid or not, I may stay. I may give middle son 1 year to get Eagle. I hate that. As for youngest, may move to Trails Life. Overall I see a lot of units folding, and membership plummeting in my area.
  16. 1 point
    Gave this some thought last night after my last post. This fee increase has the potential to be an enormous hardship for my family. I guess we'll explore financial aid first, but from what I've seen from both BSA and other financial aid programs, it doesn't usually help quite as much as we've needed. Still, we won't go anywhere. My kids like scouting too much, and I like what they gain from it. We'll just have to find a way to work it out. At the same time, I'm worried about our Troop. For the last five-ish years, we've had scouts from two towns. The second town now has it's own Troop that has been doing well, so we don't have any incoming scouts from that town anymore, and our incoming group is already smaller than even before the towns combined. After this year, eleven of our 44 scouts are aging out - a full quarter. If the financial end of things further restricts the number of scouts coming in, my youngest isn't going to have anyone to be a leader to. Not sure he'll get as much out of scouting at that point, so I may revise the 'not going anywhere' in a couple years' time. We'll see. Daughter's Crew is doing well, and is based in an affluent town. Any fee increase might affect them less.
  17. 1 point
    I'm not really sure what to make of that comment. Again, I'm suggesting is that we put disagreements with council & national in some context. It would be very easy for me to get myself very demoralized by all of this - but I chose not to because I'm pursuing a bigger, much more important goal. That goal is bringing Scouting to the youth in my community.
  18. 1 point
    Leaning towards BPSA-US. Just curious if anyone has any experience with them, or another group. Leaving the BSA is not a easy decision or one to take lightly...
  19. 1 point
  20. 1 point
    @Eagle94-A1 The photo idea is brilliant!
  21. 1 point
    Nobody will, especially because nobody has heard about this. Of course, few people have heard of scout me in. Just to totally change this thread, how is advertising money spent in the BSA? I never see any ads from the BSA on anything. Does each council have to pay for ads or does national?
  22. 1 point
    Find a council/camp that does ATV riding and maybe the pistol markmanship course. Go to a high adventure camp like Philmont, but gotta find one that is open at this time of year which prob doesn't exist. Earn the National Outdoor Awards or some other awards that no other scout in his troop has ever earned. Earn all the merit badges related to what he wants to do when he grows up/goes to college/gets a job. Do more service hours, or hiking or backpacking or insert thing here than anyone else in his unit, district, council. Have him help along other scouts who are also on deck to miss their Eagle by a month or so.
  23. 1 point
    Mmmm... Maybe just fun things like Motorboating, Shotgun Shooting, or White Water. If he's actually up for a challenge, a Hornaday might be a boast-worthy achievement, or maybe a Supernova...
  24. 1 point
    Their best option is to get in a room and sort it out. Maybe after one or two events where they are guests of each patrol, maybe right now because they are done being everyone's guests! Your son's really good friend may be itching to start a new patrol, so him and a buddy might brazenly start with the four of them and see if there's another one or two who will come along. But, some of those scouts might be aging out. Or some might be itching to band together for some super-activity. (E.g., they signed up for hike-a-month club to condition for Philmont.) So the landscape will always look much different from the little-boots-on-the-ground perspective than it does on paper.
  25. 1 point
    Thank you everyone for your responses so far. The reason I picked a thousand is not that I want all of them at once, I just want a way to replicate it. Ideally it would be to work with a patrol size at a time. Several of you said this is a hard problem, and I agree. Maybe that's why national can't figure it out either. Stosh, I suspect if this method were explained well it would also explain all the others (except for possibly uniform) as they all work together. And maybe that's a good point to make. Several of you have said it's also difficult because too many scouts just want a patch. While I agree, my approach has always been that Eagle is bait and usually scouts will learn something along the way. JoeBob, I like your idea of problem scenarios with embedded secret bad apples. One of the biggest issues scouts have is conflict. Many are so afraid of it they will get run over by anyone that just walks off. I was thinking of using the same training for the adults as the scouts. Don't they both need to understand the same issues? Eagledad, I have no desire to counter anything the BSA has said, and in this case it's easy because they really haven't said much that's coherent. Here's a first cut of the major ideas any training should focus on. A lot of this is from the PL handbook but it's boiled down and I also added some don't to help clarify some ideas. Using them to solve a set of typical problems the scouts run into would make this more hands on. The Scout Oath and Law are central to everything and should be the lens to check every decision. Trust is hugely important. Scouts in a patrol must trust each other. The adults must trust the scouts to do the right thing and the scouts must trust the adults to back them. Trust is easily destroyed and takes a long time to make. Loyal, helpful, ... A patrol is 6-8 scouts that deliver the promise of scouting to its members: What the scouts want, what the scouts need (growth and continued challenges) and what scouting wants (scouts learning to make good decisions). A patrol owns its destiny. A patrol defines success, makes its own decisions, does its own work, and is responsible for its mistakes. Adults and other scouts may encourage them but it is the patrol's responsibility to deliver. There are well defined boundaries that the patrol should clearly understand. A patrol requires: -Teamwork: Look out for each other, nobody else will. -Spirit: It makes Teamwork easier and more fun -Direction, a calendar of events, problem solving. What do the scouts want? high adventure? Low adventure? advancement? new skills? service? -Preparation: Do what you want rather than just think about it. -Persistence: Problems happen, a good attitude will turn them into opportunities. A patrol Leader: Ultimate responsibility is in your hands. A lot of this is what everyone in your patrol should be doing but you have to do a better job of it. Your scouts will look to you as an example. -The patrol goes first. Care. Participate. -Make things happen: delegate, keep everyone busy. Be Prepared. Have a backup. When your patrol flounders it's up to you to get them going again. Make a decision when needed. -Ensure your patrol members are getting the promise of scouting. Find out what they want, work with them, develop them, help them advancement, give them leadership opportunities. -Listen and watch: Pay attention to how things are going. Regularly ask how they are. -Teach any skills that are needed -Praise good deeds. Interaction between patrols is limited to games, competition, and free time. The patrols must enforce this separation. Interaction between a patrol and adults is more limited. Separation is critical. Don't solve their problems. Don't lead their scouts. Don't make their decisions. Set boundaries that are clear, simple, and static. Support them within these constraints. When they make mistakes, make sure they learn.