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This isn't about agreeing with or understanding the concept of gender identity. I'll be the first to admit, I don't understand what those kids are thinking, feeling or going through. I just know they are kids who need love and acceptance and who deserve a chance to get the benefits of Scouting. I've got Scouts that outwardly are not normal -- one on the autism spectrum, one with Downs Syndrome, one in a wheelchair. But with the rest of them it isn't evident until you get to know them. I've got a Scout with hearing loss in one ear, a Scout who has an inner sadness because his Dad pas

Okay, let's all step back a bit. When we start talking about liberals, Trump and Obama we're well past trying to come to agreement. The OP was about parents gaming the system to have their kid be the first female eagle. Here's a solution to that problem: Don't number the first 1000 female eagles. Oh, and call the parents on the obvious gaming.

I saw nothing negative in Hedgehog’s description, but rather an embracing of the quirks and foibles of each person’s individuality. It’s entirely possible to be a strong goofball, a smart goober, a well-adjusted and socially-adept geek, and a devoutly religious misfit all at the same time. Highlighting only those qualities of perfection sets up a pretty impossible standard to follow, doesn’t it? Everyone has something that makes them unique or strange to others.Your devoutly religious young man may be struggling inside with his attraction toward other men. Your strong and smart Scout may

I agree 100 percent. Instead of Swimming OR Cycling OR Hiking, I would like to see Swimming AND Cycling AND Hiking be Eagle required MBs. Wilderness Survival should be Eagle required, too. Drop a number of the bookish badges like Personal Management and Communications, and it seems that one Citizenship merit badge should suffice.

I think there is a relatively easy way to help the boys. It may sound a bit of a cliche but focus on the patrol method. A patrol of boys challenging themselves is still within the realm of BSA's program. They will do what is natural for them, have a lot of fun, and learn what we really want them to do. On father's days I was talking to my son, who completed eagle nine years ago, about the BSA. We haven't talked about it much since then but he'd fit right in on this forum. His words: scouting should be the anti-school. If it's classwork it sucks, don't do it. Also, eagle is not nearly as i

I returned from summer camp this last Saturday. I'm still in recovery mode, but it is all going well. I thought I'd share a few things. 1. There was a scout who earlier this year that had us adults concerned that he might not want to continue. He was not very interested in things and we all were concerned that he might end up dropping this year if that didn't change. Well the week before camp season started, he was talked into joining the staff. He earned BSA Lifeguard certification during the training week. When I saw him in the 2nd week of camp he was a completely different person. He

Well, I find all your self-righteous grandstanding sickening. Most of us hear have similar experiences as yours and most of us respond with similar reactions. You have no proof that any scouter here has acted or will act otherwise. But you use our posts out of context to express judgemental accusations on most of the forum list. In your hypocrisy, you are see all scouts as amazingly wonderful, but not all scouters. This is a place where scouters have an open forum to express their thoughts on these subjects. But since many of the opinions aren't your opinions, you find the differenc

I just have to say I feel this ideology is egregiously false. Gender is an inherent, essential part of who we are. It is not at all fluid - a girl cannot become a man, nor can a boy become a woman. Those who disfigure their bodies in a desperate attempt to change from one to the other will only reap misery and regret. I refuse to accept that a boy who alters his biology to become, physically, a "woman," is a woman - he is still male inside, and nothing he does will ever change that. And vice versa. This, of course, is strongly related to my beliefs, which hold powerfully that we existed before

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/barbara-kay-the-male-crisis-thats-ruining-our-boys-and-no-one-cares-about I’m posting this article because it hints to what many of us were saying during adding girls debate. The article is mostly centered around fatherless boys, but there is some mention of what boys need to develop their instinctive nature that I’ve talked about in other threads. For example: “As Farrell and Gray explain: “The traditional boy’s journey to self-sacrifice incorporated service to others, and required responsibility, loyalty, honour, and accountability. It created his m

No, following Kenny Roger's advice: " know when to hold 'em. Know when to fold 'em. Know when to walk away. Know when to run." I can be more effective, do more good, and not deal with all the crap by working with my sons and their friends.

Or church.

I didn't intend to be self-righteous or grandstanding. If I came across that way, I apologize. My purpose was to encourage people to look at this a different way. Let me tell you a bit about myself. I'm very conservative - voted Republican every time except once where I voted for a third-party candidate that was more conservative. I'm Catholic and take my Church's teachings on issues like sexuality, abortion and compassion very seriously. If you asked me about transgender kids three years ago, my response would have been to consider those kids abnormal freaks (my words, not any of yo

One could debate the sloppiness but the tent number is not clear so the job isn’t done. I’d recommend you work with them on fixing the issue with the scouts and let them know they should feel empowered to ask questions if something doesn’t look quite right. Overall a good life lesson is awaiting them!

I think setting the date for the first female Eagle BOR would make sense. Then Nationals should approve the first group of female Eagle Scouts on the same date. I have no idea how they would handle someone who selected “boy” and is a current star scout and then selects “girl” on an application change Feb 1, 2019. That will probably happen. I would think Nationals should investigate those cases and take appropriate action if they lied on their original application. As I mentioned, someone admitted to this in a FB comment that this was their plan. After being called out on this by som

Actually it is, or was. This all started when Obama used a loop hole in the law to leverage adults to claim asylum as a relatives of children. That is how uncles and aunts, great uncles and great great aunts are using the system to get into the US. Obama was just better at hiding it. Your use of moral high ground is as malleable as your uses of sex and gender. Barry

Much effort went into improving schooling for girls when school was viewed as less important for them and that was much needed. Girls are doing much better than in decades past. Now boys are falling behind, dropping out in much greater numbers and much more likely to end up in prison. I don't claim to have all the answers, but more effort now needs to go into addressing the problems boys are facing. When I say that, some people have a knee-jerk reaction to think that girls will be pushed aside again. That's not the case at all. I have a daughter and a son. I want them both to succeed

You are not born in to a gender. You are born in to a sex. Gender is how one expresses themselves - and yes, it's as much a choice as choosing one's religion. It's just a lot more uncommon to choose to express a gender that is opposite of one's sex. So liberals need to start treating people like human beings? How is treating someone the way they want to be treated not treating people like human beings? It's not liberals separating children from their parents and putting them in to internment camps on our southern border.

Many kids who go through this do not change their biology. For them, they do not need to. They already feel that they are the other gender and so physical steps are not necessary. But, yes, some do. Again - all I'm asking is that we be mindful of the rhetoric around the Scouts - all the Scouts. You may not have yet met a transgender kid, but it is coming. These kids have hard enough life as it is. @Hedgehog's crew sounds like a great group. If you are some day faced with these kinds of decisions please simply do the same.

I met the first kid I knew who was coming to terms with with gender identity questions about 5 years ago. The kid has not transitioned, but was clearly trying to figure things out. In the back of my mind I thought - it has to be easier if the parent stops this. Over time I got to know the kid and realized he was like every other kid - but his struggle was gender identity. About two years ago I found out that a kid that I have known for his whole life was going to counseling for gender identity issues. I've known this kid all his life. He's a wonderful kid - has the same struggles as

So this whole discussion is purely hypothetical based on which might happen by people on both sides who have never knowingly met a transgender person. We have two transgender kids in our Crew. One is gender neutral and one identifies with the gender that is different than what is listed on the birth certificate. Guess what? They are kids like any other kid. I'll vouch for the fact that NONE of the kids in our Crew or Troop are normal. They are all goofballs, goobers, geeks and misfits -- that is why I like them so much. There is no other group of kids I'd rather spend a weekend camp

I know I'm repeating myself, but I think it is relevant to a number of the posts that have appeared since I last said this: No unit is required to accept a transgender Scout. "Thank you for your interest in our troop, but it is the BSA's policy that your child be placed in a troop that is most able to handle circumstances such as this, so we are referring you to the council office for placement in another troop." Simple. And council will back you up, because you're following the rules. Where is little Charlie-was-Suzie going to sleep on the camping trip? Wherever the other tro

Different question. hopefully an easier one. where will a trans ( female to male ) scout tent? with the girls patrol? then we are not treating her/him as a boy. the boys? scary alone? ostracizing

I have. Very informative, and one of the reason why I am against coed Scouting. That said I am glad I am homeschooling as schools are very rapidly becoming toxic to boys.

What with all the gloom. doom, and turmoil in this section of late, I thought it might be no bad thing to remember and recount a few of our high points on the scouting trail. I'll start. Troop meeting night, I was near the end of my 12 month term as SPL and feeling pretty burned out. Between the troop, the Explorer Post, the IWLA shooting team, OA ceremonies, church,school, and falling in love I was a very busy young man. While driving to the meeting in my car, I mused on the sheer irony of it. As a new tenderfoot I had looked up at the older scouts of the senior patro

I haven't been around the forums for about a year. I was too busy with the Troop, the Crew, raising a son and working a paying job in between all of that. I also figured there would be a lot of drama with all of the changes in the BSA program. I came back yesterday only to realize that, according to most of the threads and posts on the forum, THE SKY IS FALLING, SCOUTING IS DOOMED and everyone is RUNNING, not walking, FOR THE EXITS. Just WOW. Former House Speaker Tip O'Neal would say that all politics are local, I would say all Scouting is local. Scouting is thriving where I am

Well, that's exactly the point. They're not our beliefs. My unit would still stand firm to expound and defend traditional boy scout values, just as we have for the past 40 years, but BSA has abandoned those values, so we have nothing left to support anymore. We no longer have a responsibility to BSA.

I'm curious to know how your 11-14 year old girls will feel about attending a co-ed summer camp with boy troops (because co-ed BSA summer camps will be the reality). Speaking only for our 11-14 year old boys, the idea of co-ed summer camp is anathema to them. They would rather skip summer camp altogether and do our own wilderness camp instead.

My apologies to Hedgehog and Parkman for going too far with my response. I tend to be a bit defensive when posters demonize adult leaders to make a point. I'm will step back and say that while that is how I interpreted their post, I was wrong. It's one thing to reflect on experiences, but something different when strawmen are the excuse to preach. I am just as defensive with posters who attack scouts the same way. The subjects of scouts and scouters with different non typical sexual identities are difficult because there is a broad opinions on the subjects. Which is fine, I enjoy differen

I hope you didn't use Coleman fuel to clean up the splatter on the tents - that's a sure fire way to destroy all water resistance in that area of the tenant.

Who is going to be sued for the first pregnant 'Boy' Scout? STDs anyone?

When we are asked this question, in our district, we get a Tom Sawyer response. For example, Scoutmaster: I think the district should have a STEM event. District Chair or DE: OK, so you’re hosting the next camproee! Cubmaster: We really need some help in recruitment. District Chair: Great, we will make you district membership chair. So my advise is to listen to what they have to say, take the good ideas and make a plan, get the help you need and execute. Please don't throw it back on their shoulders of the one who suggested it unless they are voluntee

Better Round Table instruction. Too many times I've gone to RT where the breakout options were: How to score JTE, How to use ScoutBook, or I was assigned to teach X, here is what I found on the internet. Naturally, the instructors treated the class as an assignment rather than an opportunity to share knowledge. If I were in your position, I would visit with Scouters and ask them what they want to learn and also what they would be interested in teaching. There's a herpetologist in my district that always draws a crowd when he teaches a class. It may have something to do with the three or f

Ask them what they want. I'm now our district camping chair. I've been trying to get a discussion going with the SMs to get them involved with coming up with camporees that help support them. I'm pushing patrol method but other than that I just want events that they want to come to. I've gone to troops and asked scouts for ideas. The response has been a surprise, as in they are surprised that anyone would ask. So far it's worked well.

Agree that it is local and at more importantly at the unit level. All else is window dressing. The divide (rift??) between National/Region/Council/District and the local units seems to be a might wider at times. There is a lot of top down directives, etc. Is the Council there to support the units or does the Council seem to think they are where it's at. With our unit we seem to be fine with little interaction from the council. Close to 100 Scouts, High adventure every year, 13 outings per year, 10+ Eagles achieved each year. Our discussion has been how can we support Scouting locall

Whooo! I finally made Brotherhood. Missed my first chance by being hospitalized in May. It is a nice ceremony. Shhhhh... Scoutmaster Teddy

Congratulations on your choice to seal your membership in the Order. I went thru mine in 1984. Of course, many things have changed since then, but the bonds of Brotherhood are lasting.

Alternatively many of us may well have met someone transgender without even realising it. It's still not an easy thing to admit to and many who are trans either don't admit to themselves are just keep quiet about it.

Bravo. Well said.

Keep the fire burning brothers

Pope Francis has made it clear that he does not agree with the concept of gender identity.

Great stories, thanks all! The big experiences were great, but it is the subtle ones that mean the most to me now. My second camporee. Southern Arizona desert grasslands. Friday night it rained buckets but finally let up. We had a fire going, with a deep bed of glowing coals. One of the scout's dad was helping out that weekend, a very decent gent. We stayed by the fire and chatted while most of the others turned in. I'll never forget his kindness and willingness to talk with a newbie Tenderfoot. My first year on camp staff in Alaska. I was assigned to the rifle range. I

It is more likely than you may think that you have at least crossed paths with a transgender person. The majority have no obvious indicators.

Castle doctrine invoked.

Welcome home, Hedge. I would ask your permission to reprint your "confession" in our Scout District Newsletter , pretty please?

You accept them for something that they are not, correct? I'm sorry, but to call yourself a boy does not actually make you a boy.

When the Webelos and their parents come over to visit the Troop, the boys are temporarily assigned to patrols and the parents are taken aside. The SPL or ASPLs then talk to the parents to tell them about the program. As SM, I'm in the room but I couldn't get a word in edgewise. The first words out of the SPL/ASPL is "we are a boy -led Troop. That means that the adults are here for just health and safety reasons." The second thought is "We are a patrol-based Troop. The patrol leaders run their patrols and our jobs are to help the patrol leaders succeed and to coordinate the patrols to wo

Most of my memories of Scouting as a youth are largely negative; I was bullied mercilously by the other boys, but since they were part of the same congregation that paid for me to be in Scouting in the first place, looking for another troop was not an option, so I had to get by on nothing but patience and forgiveness. But there was one camp-out that stands out to me, for many, many reasons. First of all, it was the most grueling, miserable hike of my life. Now, understand, I was tiny for my age; at 13 I was 4'11 and not even 100 lbs. And I never did any kind of sports, so I was not accust

Ah the memories. Pretty difficult to choose! A few that spring to mind, my Queens Scout parade, we got to taught to march by The Irish Guards who were on ceremonial duties at Windsor Castle at the time. The regimental sergeant major accused me of marching like a thunder bird. I was truly dreadful at it! His comments made me laugh and find it even harder. Being elected scouts scout of the year when I was about 15. I was getting a hard time at school at the time. Basically the working class kid at a very middle class school where I struggled to fit in. My scout troop mostly had the sam

@MattR & @desertrat77 , Thanks for taking on this responsibility. In my head I picture your recruitment going much like my recruitment as Cubmaster: "So... we noticed that you're coming to all the meetings anyway..."

Oh, I would never do that. The idea that one must "accept any and all beliefs" was never my desire. Like B-P once said (paraphrase) a Scout's faith is generally determined by his family. Since there are so many different types of worship, I would never point and say THIS one is correct, all the rest are poor imitations. No, no, no. Not my decision. Not yours (or anyone's) either. We can only "do our best", and when the final exam comes around, see if we pass. One of my favorite comedians Emo Phillips wrote/created a joke about this... Once I saw this guy on a brid