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Showing content with the highest reputation on 01/30/18 in all areas

  1. 5 points
    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/455874/toxic-masculinity-myth-fuels-culture-wars Yah, I change the title just a bit. But the article described, at least to me, exactly what has been going on in the BSA for the last 15 years. For many of us, Boy Scouts is where a boy becomes a man of character. A man proud to be a husband, father, civic leader and a moral role model. It wasn't a boys club where male boys huddled together conspiring to bring out the worst of humanism, just as some here still believe. Scouting is a culture that challenges the masculinity of young men so that they can learn how to shape themselves into citizens of character and leaders of integrity. Scouting is a culture where young adult males find the limits of their character without the interference of guilt to prevent the lesson of learning their role in the community. Scouting was a safe place where a boy could face the limitations of maleness in a complex world without feeling guilty. It's not an anti female culture. Quite the contrary, the scout program is a pro equal culture program. It just does it by taking out out the static of multi-humanist biases and opinions until each scout can sort our their deficiencies in practicing the Scout Law and Oath, and then make a conscious change to better themselves for their future in the community. I am a full believer in building ethical and moral decision makers. I've been in the middle of the BSA cultural discussions about as long as they have been on Scouter.com. So, I know the debates. I laugh because I remember when 90 percent of the discussions on Scouter.com were in the "Patrol Method", "Cub Scouts", "Advancement", "Camping", and "Open Discussion" forums. Those were the good ol days of discussing scouting stuff. We haven't seen that in a while. I think this article describes the Scouting Cultural divide very well. I don't expect anything to change. But I think the article helps explains why some of us scouters believe the traditional program has a more positive influence on the community than this new program that is just turning into another after school youth program. Enjoy. Barry
  2. 4 points
    Has any boy of the scout age ever felt they needed more character? Scouting is an adult program designed to develop boys into men of character (A game with a purpose). The attraction for boys is the adventure. The exhilaration of experiencing the independence for making responsible decisions is what keeps them in the program after the exhilaration of adventure becomes balanced with normality. Barry
  3. 3 points
    I think there's still an opportunity to start a much better discussion than whether or not you'll become an eagle scout. If you were an SPL then talk about some skills you developed in that roll. Teamwork, leadership, making things happen, solving problems. That's why someone might hire you, so talk about that. If someone isn't really sure about what eagle means then it might be better to talk about what you've done in words they understand.
  4. 2 points
    Really frustrating chat with one of the ASMs. He wants to go out an buy a bunch of tents without any input from the Scouts. He says that the Scouts don't have any idea what to look for, including those who have been in the troop a while and/or having camping MB. They will only pick "what looks cool." Futher he commented on how if they are asked to do something, they will do a poor job of doing the research, and it will take 6 months to get the stuff ordered. This is based upon one Scout's research into stoves, and after 6 months we are now getting them. I could not reply as I had to get back to work. But A) the Scout was limited to one company's models and he came up with 2 for the troop to pick, and B) the reason I was told we waited for the stoves is because the SM wanted a troop debit card, and with the death of the primary on the checking account, everything is on hold until things get cleared. The ASM bought the stoves on his CC and got reinbursed, which is how things had been done in the past. But just the lack of faith in the Scouts is disturbing. I admit the Scouts are not doing things like my peers back in the day did. But we also didn't have adults jumping in and taking over when things are not going the way the adults expect them.
  5. 2 points
    Ya know ... I always pride myself on being technically current and usually ahead of the game. In fact, that's how I make my living. ... BUT ... I have zero interest in having my son track his advancement online. If he wants to look and see it fine. But as much as possible, I want them face-to-face. They will easy enough learn computers and moving forms about. IMHO, scouting is about that interaction. Encouraging scouts to update data in ScoutBook defeats alot of scouting's benefit. As long as I can, I'll encourage my son to use his paper scout handbook to track advancement. Please note that I as a leader and adult want everything online. Advancement. Leader manuals. Trip plans. It all makes my life easier. But for my son and his friends, I really hope they stay with paper as long as possible.
  6. 2 points
    I’m in the med device industry and I’ve seen this with PMP (project management professional) and various nursing certifications (CNA, RN, etc.). However, I do agree some can go overboard. Generally it’s a red flag if the characters in your degree and certification list exceed your name length. 😀 As far as eagle candidate on your resume I’d keep it to Life Scout for now. At 15 that is a great accomplishment.
  7. 2 points
    Personally I think the I&P section is healthy, especially during these times. It is intended to be a safe place to learn and understand how others think differently. I think one reason other threads aren't as active is because new members feel some hostility in the answers to their questions. So, they don't hang around. I'm sure I'm part of the problem also. Where the I&P goes off track is when posts get personal forcing additional responses to defend or equalize the offending post. Still, I think the positives outweigh the negatives. I would love to experiment one thread with a rule that each poster only gets one post to express their opinion, and then see how the discussion tracks. I really have no idea, but it would be a fun experiment. Barry
  8. 2 points
    And now...Here's Part 3 of Green Bar Bill's "Patrol Ideas!" This edition features articles on Patrol hiking, equipment, and camping! Patrol_Ideas_by_Green_Bar_Bill_pt3.pdf
  9. 2 points
    Other than that, its great!
  10. 2 points
    That's the point. Either have two-deep adult leadership (no matter the gender of the adults) or require one man/woman if at least one boy/girl are part of the event. As pointed out a few times here, the Venturing YP rules are very good and a great guide to use. It is simple and fair.
  11. 2 points
    GSUSA has had a long-standing policy of inclusiveness when it comes to sexual orientation. It goes back to at least the 90s, although really they had the policy all along, as there was no ban on the books. I don't think they ever had a policy on transgender scouts either, but there was an issue in 2011 where a girl was kicked out and then later re-admitted, so I guess you could say their policy became more "official" at that time. They won't allow boys. There's no need to. I know this will sound kind of jerky, but... there aren't any boys that want to get in to GSUSA. Unless they change their own policy to try competing with the BSA, there's not much incentive to do anything different than they are today.
  12. 1 point
    You have obviously mistaken me (for reasons that I suppose I can understand) for a person who believes that "cultural appropriation" is a "thing." (Or as we would have said back in my day, a "real thing.") But I am not. If I was, I would be complaining that people who are not Jewish, but who use words like klutz, glitch, chutzpah, bagel and nudnik (from which we get beatnik, peace-nik, no-good-nik and all the other -nik's), and many other words (some of which I won't mention here because this is a family forum), "stole" them from "my culture," specifically from the Yiddish language spoken by my grandparents and their ancestors and all the other Jewish people who immigrated here from 1880-1920 (ish) from Eastern Europe. But I don't. I don't care. Use all the Yiddish words you want. Have a bagel. Have a blintz. Have some kreplach (a dumpling by any other name would taste as good.) And I don't think the Italians mind if you have some lasagna, or the Chinese if you have some wontons (see kreplach) or the Hungarians if you have any of those dishes that I can't pronounce or spell that my wife makes for us now and then. That does not mean that I think it's a bad idea to move away from some of the uses of depictions of Native Americans. I view it in terms of respect. Does the usage respect the culture that it is depicting? And I guess what goes into that is, Is it accurate? Is it reasonably dignified? And I suppose that the wishes of the group being depicted are part of the mix in determining whether it is respectful, as well. Chief Wahoo is not respectful, and he's on his way out. What about the OA? Are all of the lodges in the country respectful of the culture they are depicting? I don't really know enough to say. The last time I was even peripherally involved with OA was 1976, although I could have re-upped my membership when I came back to Scouting. But from what I have read in this forum over the years, it's probably a mixed bag. That being the case, if I had a vote on the subject, it would probably to try to find some other symbology for the OA.
  13. 1 point
    He's on Babylon Bee right now too! Jordan Peterson Convinces Pile Of Clean Laundry To Sort Itself Out http://babylonbee.com/news/jordan-peterson-convinces-pile-clean-laundry-sort/
  14. 1 point
    We no longer have Troop tents...no one took good enough care of them. We tried to pair up tent buddies right away. The first thing we used to do for newbies was to warn them to wait for a few campouts to avoid making a bad tent decision. See what the other adults and scouts bring on the campouts. We often have an older experienced scout who camps a lot go over the pros and cons of tents, tent sizes, and weights. When we left it to adults they usually went the cheapest route and sometimes got heavy tents that were fine for car camping but not if scouts had to carry them very far. In fact we caution new families to borrow or make do for gear initially--at least on the 'big 3' tent, backpacking, and sleeping-bag as their is a lot to learn. We also encourage some in-troop trading and buying as boys go off to college. One of our most experienced Scouters made up a good overview on the "big 3" and we hand that out to new parents (but not the first meeting--they are quite overwhelmed right away).
  15. 1 point
    Getting back to the subject at hand. Which part of boy-led is this ASM not getting? If the Troop needs new tents, the Scouts should figure out what the proper tents are and then report back to the purchasing authority. If they need some direction on research, there are many online sources of information, or they could visit a large outdoor retailer (the equipment guys at REI really seem to know their stuff). If they are given some hints, they are less likely to fail at this. If they do fail, they will learn something along the way. Isn't that part of the point of Scouting?
  16. 1 point
    Not in our troop or state.... Our troop uses troop tents for the youth and most campgrounds here do not allow hammocks. I hope you can get the scouts driving the process of selection and ordering with Adult help.
  17. 1 point
    Sounds like they should take a trip to the sporting goods store to talk about tents. The ASM and the Quartermaster and SM/parents. It should be scout led and adult guided if there are any questions or issues that the scouts didn't think of.
  18. 1 point
    Then why doesn't Sea Scout and Venturing YPT allow for 2 females if a ship or crew is coed?
  19. 1 point
    It's not so much orchestrating the game differently, but allowing the freedom to experiment with decisions without interference of girls. I know from experience that the choices youth make will very greatly depending whether the opposite sex is within the vicinity. How many of us have watch our own children change their demeanor in some of the activities when we as their parents got near them? Same goes with Girl Scouts. Barry
  20. 1 point
    Yup. That and the hold back for liability coverage. Explains the increase in fees a great deal. Little having to do with delivering the program to kids; lots to do with CYA from over-investment in The Summit, under-collection of promised funds. Their liquidity is a joke. Looking at the revenue streams makes one wonder exactly how long they can keep this up. They need a serious revenue injection that doesn't come with a bunch of increased liability. Increasing membership is NOT that stream.
  21. 1 point
    It's S-F (pronounced S Bar F) scout ranch its a Camp owned by the Greater St. Louis Area Council, the camp I work at is one of only a few patrol method cooking only camps in the country left.
  22. 1 point
    FYI, and out of interest...UK HQ directly employ about 300 people full time for about 450,000 young people. Though counties also employ a few people, we have at least one admin person, and staff to run campsites, in our County that's 13,500 young people and 3,500 volunteers, and about 3 employees, excluding campsite staff. UK wide volunteers, there's about 100,000 of us. Sometimes it's a bit creaky, and things don't happen as fast as an employee would get them done but...we muddle through.
  23. 1 point
    "Boy Scout: Life Rank, Senior Patrol Leader" Outside of Scouting, most folks have no idea what the terms "Life Rank" or "Senior Patrol Leader" mean. I think this is why the Eagle Scout Project Workbook uses the term "Eagle Scout Candidate". I think it would be acceptable to say Eagle Scout Candidate or Eagle Scout rank, anticipated winter 2018 (or something similar). Most folks would understand both of these to mean that you are close to earning Eagle Scout rank, but haven't earned it yet. This would be similar to applying for a job that requires a degree while you are still in college. Something like: John Smith, Bachelor of Science in Nursing, expected June 2018.
  24. 1 point
    Perhaps the discussions would focus on those things more if the issues and politics forum went away. And any mention of such topics were moderated away.
  25. 1 point
    Should that matter when it comes to protection. It’s sad to hear adult leaders making a case for not protecting everyone. It’s a simple solution require a man to be present when male youth are present. We do this one Venturing all the time.
  26. 1 point
    This is the Scouting program for urban youth, at schools, etc. Learning for Life (LFL) is a United States school and work-site based youth program that is a subsidiary of the Boy Scouts of America. It utilizes programs designed for schools and community-based organizations that are designed to prepare youth for the complexities of contemporary society and to enhance their self-confidence, motivation, and self-esteem, and for careers. Learning for Life is not considered a traditional Scouting program; it does not use the Scout Promise, Scout Law, uniforms or insignia of traditional Scouting. All Learning for Life programs are open to youth and adults without restriction based on gender, residence, religion, sexual orientation, or other considerations, other than minimum age requirements. Some Explorer posts may require background checks and satisfactory school transcripts as conditions of membership. There were many issues with "Scouts" being registered. As you can see the membership dropped 36% from 2010 - 2014 as these issues were revealed. Youth membership Year 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 Exploring 113,180 112,783 116,584 114,894 110,853 Learning for Life 664,063 511,359 475,280 418,484 422,139
  27. 1 point
    I threw that out as a mostly random number, with maybe the slight logic behind it being that it's the number at which I would guess it becomes impossible for National to maintain their operations in the existing structure. 2 million, and it's already happening. They just cut pensions. Pay cuts and job cuts will follow. Absolutely. But the governing body of the organization will have to be completely re-thought. It can't be this big corporate operation anymore. I don't think 100% volunteer-run is sustainable, if you want good people to run the show they need to be able to devote themselves to it and that takes a lot of time. But we could do it with far fewer salaried employees and much more modest salaries for top executives.
  28. 1 point
    Can I interest you in a prime piece of property in lovely West Virginia?? Got some neat zip lines. There is a this rather annoying balloon bond payment coming up, but maybe we can work through that.
  29. 1 point
    My understanding the OA (BSA) has NOT branded any images of Native Americans., just arrow images. Meanwhile, the long goodbye of Cleveland Indian Chief Wahoo has begun. ... well at least from uniforms and billboards. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/29/sports/baseball/cleveland-indians-chief-wahoo-logo.html
  30. 1 point
    First, there are no audited numbers and a history of padding. We lost a Scout Executive in 1926 over paper membership, the executive who left circa 2008 left 30% paper members (Council took the hit the next year as the new SE would not tolerate the practice, bless him.), and NBC reported an FBI investigation of membership padding to drive charitable contributions in 2005 (AKA "the Birmingham Scandal," wherein Ronnie Holmes got caught doing it again http://www.starnewsonline.com/news/20060603/probe-finds-alabama-boy-scout-group-inflated-membership-by-13000-youths/2 ) So if we accept BSA unaudited numbers (And what else do we have?), you are correct. We lost only 25% by the end of 1976 and only 31% by the end of the last year of the ISP, 1978. But as the goal was a big increase (Recall "Boy Power"?), not much to crow about. And the bleeding was stabilized, not stopped, when BSA went BACK to the past with Bill. Cause and effect? One can speculate. But certainly the "new" did not correspond with improvement except in its title.
  31. 1 point
    I don't think the GSUSA will ever accept boys as members. I don't think it's even an issue within that organization. As for "homosexuals," they dropped their policy of excluding "homosexuals" long before the BSA did. Not that I'm an expert on GSUSA. Both my daughters quit the Girl Scouts more than 20 years ago. But that's what I've read.
  32. 1 point
    It’ll probably end up as “Scouts”
  33. 1 point
  34. 1 point
  35. 1 point
  36. 1 point
    Can everyone at least agree that: When male Scouters are treated differently from female Scouters with regard to YPT, that is unequal. And unfair.
  37. 1 point
    No. That is what you inferred. I said that the Oath and Law implies we -- all Scouts and Scouter, including national and our national leaders -- treat everyone equally. I also said that while "equality" is not mentioned as part of the Oath and Law, treating people equally and fairly is implied. So, in creating a standard by which female Scouters are treated differently than male Scouters, national is creating a double standard and not treating everyone equally. I also said that we do treat people differently based on needs and certain special situations, in general we should strive to treat people equal based on things like sex, and to do otherwise was unfair and against the Oath and Law. That's what I said.
  38. 1 point
    Once again decline in participation in social organizations is not the same issue as changes in physical products for sale. It is a facile, shallow argument. I see why you use it, it is the language National keeps using but I think they are wrong too. @Col. Flagg has a point...if they are rolling the dice on this they really show no signs of that they had an organized plan.
  39. 1 point
    Have you not been paying attention to the circus in Irving? There is no girls program in place to date, yet they've marketed a product they don't have. That's evidence plenty. The fact they've announced a new product -- yet to be developed -- and are marketing the heck out of it is proof they are doing this backwards. It doesn't require any inside knowledge. Just read what national has been saying and doing. It is obvious to anyone with any education and experience in running a large organization. No one is arguing that she hasn't been tagging along and doing stuff for years. The point is she is not yet (nor was she at the time) a Boy Scout, ergo credit cannot be given unless BSA changes the rules. Clearly, getting Eagle is clearly the MAIN reason she has been doing what she's doing, otherwise she (and her lawyer father) would not be pressing BSA to speed up the timeline.
  40. 1 point
    Other than the obvious answer of not spelling Candidate as Canidate , I would not put it on my resume. Would you put Life Scout candidate if you were a Star Scout? You want your resume to reflect your accomplishments - Eagle Scout Candidate is not an accomplishment - it says you are hoping to become an Eagle Scout in the future. The only thing your resume should indicate is a hope for the future is a statement listing what kind of job or career you are desiring. For now, just state that you are a Boy Scout as one of your activities. Hold off on listing Eagle Scout until after the medal is pinned to your shirt.
  41. 1 point
    You are an active scout with the current rank of "Life". That is actually pretty impressive.
  42. 1 point
    Every soldier is a candidate for the Medal of Honor, but I don't think they all put that down on their resume.
  43. 1 point
    I would read: "Not an Eagle Scout." And I was in charge of hiring for my department at the telephone company. You have, I think, the correct instinct. Don't stretch the truth. It may lead to uncomfortable questions if you reach the interview stage.
  44. 1 point
    It establishes a double standard. It says we trust trained women to be around boys but we don’t trust trained men to be around girls. That’s wrong. Either you treat everyone equally or you don’t integrate the program. With all the noise about equality and equal chances to put in a stupid policy like this just shows they’re not serious about equality. It’s just a buzz word to get their way.
  45. 1 point
    Ok, boys and girls...Here's Part 2 of Green Bar Bill's "Patrol Ideas" for your viewing pleasure. Good Scouting to you! Patrol_Ideas_by_Green_Bar_Bill_pt2.pdf
  46. 1 point
    I found a 2010 printing of the Patrol Leader Handbook online. The Troop Program Features are simply canned meetings that anyone should be able to pick up and run with, provided they have the materials, etc.
  47. 0 points
    What Ronnie Holmes did was NOT (emphasis) uncommon. I know of several councils that had issues like that.
  48. -1 points
    Wow, that's a split hair. I didn't realize there were degrees to which cultural appropriation was offensive. Is wearing a Mexican hat (but not imitating the behavior of Mexicans) okay? You can't be a little bit pregnant here. Either one is culturally appropriating or you are not. It is either fine or it is not.
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