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  2. Just a reminder, our bankruptcy is because BSA waited way too long to install hearty youth protection from abuse. Many of us (myself included) used to laugh at that … then a co worker of mine, an Eagle Scout and Vigil Honor member, got to visit Club Fed for child pedophilia. I remember calling the Council Director of Support Services as the word of the arrest (it was at work and public) filtered through our workforce. When I got him, he had been tipped off by the US Attorney, and was already preparing the severance letter. I've never laughed about YP since.
  3. The fears are real and founded. We need to be empathetic to the kids. In my experience, what is needed is to pose the problem of not having meetings being a problem that needs to be solved. Let them know the problem and maybe even some solutions that have worked for other units. Ask and listen to their ideas and solutions. I am not doubting that your husband is already doing this BTW. In my experience if they feel they own the problem they will come up with a solution that they will fight for. We are much smaller than a troop but we have been able to meet in small groups, masked, socially distanced, and activities following CDC guidelines. Zoom meetings every so often. So I don't pretend to say our situations are the same. but there are ways forward. All our units are hurting and recruitment is almost impossible. Honestly the biggest problems with people following guidelines have been the adults complaining and not following them. I pull them aside and have private conversations, normally there is denial and grumbling but they come around. Here are things I have seen that have worked: Small group camping, youth stay in their own tent. Hikes, masks on whenever they are six feet or closer. meetings in camp chairs in a circle chairs six feet apart learning a scout skill. Playing scout games like charades. canoeing, sailing, bicycle rides Just some ideas. good luck
  4. A hike or a bike ride are both great ideas. Do keep in mind temps are dropping below freezing at night, thus beginning the winter cycle, as far South as Kansas City to St Louis. Be prepared
  5. Today
  6. I live here in Kansas City, and used to know a National VFW player in their youth serving support. Regrettably he has since passed, but I think you'll find VFW National will be informing VFW local Posts. Cannot speak for other organizations.
  7. I agree. There is so much ill will that could be created here among so many community groups that I don't see how scouting in any form could withstand it. Scouts is in another impossible situation but the fact that COs have had, as far as I know, practically no direct communication from National on this as it developed has probably been alarming to the ones who have been paying attention. What will happen to the ones who aren't paying attention and don't file a claim and wind up suffering losses? The Methodist church makes out OK but the AME church or VFW down the street does not? Whose moral responsibility is it to tell them to file by Nov. 16?
  8. Youth all over are having a hard time with this and are coping with it differently. Be aware some kids are not so much afraid of getting it themselves but may be living with high risk adults and are very fearful of bringing anything home to them. They may not want to verbalize that they are freaked out over losing mom or dad, especially if they are teens. The cold might be more of a convenient excuse in that case. Many kids are also totally done with zoom. Maybe encourage them to think less 'meet' and more is there anything safe and fun they can do as an outdoor activity at least for bonding where they'd be moving around and staying warmer? Social distance hike or outdoor service project like a trail clearing...
  9. Why are they filing? Yup. This liability to the CO's is going to be the real driver behind whether the BSA survives or not. If CO's drop their units in mass to avoid future liability, this will be the end of the BSA in it's current structure. I'm already steeling myself that National and the Council's will lose everything. If they don't I'll be pleasantly surprised.
  10. Once upon a time (March?) I think there was some notion that this would be limited to National and the Councils. Now, it has become clear that the plaintiffs are not going to stop with National and the Councils, the COs would be, as you imply, utter morons NOT to at least put in the claim (they all either list a price of $0 or simply leave it blank) in order to preserve their rights.
  11. DOH! Fixed, I stripped ALL links from EVERYTHING.
  12. Fears are always uneven. The small patrol meetings might be the best compromise. How spread out are you all geographically? Is there a farm or local park where you could camp? What is your school district doing? All are driving factors. If you could walk to a park and meet with the PLC, that would help.
  13. Moderator note. Some of those executive claim links have not redacted home addresses, phone numbers, and email addresses, so I hid post. @CynicalScouter if you want to re-post just those redacted claim links e.g. Mosby and Surbaugh that should be fine. Thanks, RS @MattR @John-in-KC
  14. At this point, from an objective viewpoint, it seems like every CO group ought to be doing the same thing out of sense of self preservation -- American Legions, Volunteer Fire Departments, VFWs, private schools. I don't know if others were anticipating this but it seems like a mess on top of a mess to me.
  15. Some other new, interesting claimants against BSA. Lots of of National and Council Executives filing claims. "National Council Restoration Plan Claim" C443 10/21/2020 John H. Mosby C434 10/20/2020 Michael B Surbaugh C435 10/20/2020 Jason Stein C424 10/18/2020 Randall Kopsa C422 10/17/2020 Raymond E Gallison Jr C423 10/17/2020 Kohl, Dennis J C418 10/15/2020 John M. Primrose C17 10/13/2020 Joseph S. Coco C400 10/13/2020 Joseph S Coco C192 10/12/2020 Holmes, Ronald W C191 10/08/2020 Cabeza, John C391 10/08/2020 Gary Butler C396 10/07/2020 Estate of Richard J Mathews C387 10/06/2020 Foster Selman, Jr C16 10/05/2020 John E Marden Jr C383 10/05/2020 David L Campbell C395 10/05/2020 Blackwell, Raymond L C397 10/05/2020 Moore, Paul R
  16. Whose is next? The Lutherans? The Catholics? Claim No Claim Date Filed Creditor C438 10/21/2020 Alamo Heights United Methodist Church C442 10/21/2020 First United Methodist Church of Del Rio C439 10/21/2020 Ingleside United Methodist Church C440 10/21/2020 Oxford United Methodist Church of San Antonio Texas C441 10/21/2020 St Luke United Methodist Church Austin C437 10/21/2020 St Mark United Methodist Church C451 10/22/2020 Bartlett United Methodist Church, Inc. C457 10/22/2020 Belle Meade United Methodist Church C466 10/22/2020 Bethany United Methodist Church of Austin C455 10/22/2020 Bethel United Methodist Church Chewsville C444 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church C471 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church C469 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church - Laredo C449 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church Brownsville C458 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church Mission, Texas Inc. C464 10/22/2020 First United Methodist Church Murfreesboro C461 10/22/2020 Gary Memorial United Methodist Church C462 10/22/2020 Glen Mar UMC C474 10/22/2020 Grace United Methodist Church Houghton MI C465 10/22/2020 Grandville United Methodist Church C472 10/22/2020 Grosse Pointe United Methodist Church C446 10/22/2020 Highland United Methodist Church C454 10/22/2020 Kerrville First United Methodist Church C459 10/22/2020 Millers United Methodist Church C452 10/22/2020 Mt Carmel United Methodist Church C473 10/22/2020 Mt. Pleasant First United Methodist Church C447 10/22/2020 Saint John's United Methodist Church C445 10/22/2020 Schertz United Methodist Church C450 10/22/2020 St. Andrew's United Methodist Church C467 10/22/2020 The Summit Church C453 10/22/2020 United Methodist Church of Brady C468 10/22/2020 Walled Lake UMC C460 10/22/2020 Wesley Grove United Methodist Church C549 10/23/2020 Alamo United Methodist Church C546 10/23/2020 Arapaho United Methodist Church C520 10/23/2020 Ardsley United Methodist Church C25 10/23/2020 Bethany United Methodist Church (187831) C531 10/23/2020 Bethany United Methodist Church (187831) C505 10/23/2020 Blanchard-Pineriver United Methodist Church C482 10/23/2020 Blanche UMC C548 10/23/2020 Bloomfield United Methodist Church C512 10/23/2020 Clinton Avenue United Methodist Church C541 10/23/2020 Derby United Methodist Church C542 10/23/2020 Dixboro United Methodist Church C527 10/23/2020 Emmanuel United Methodist Church C501 10/23/2020 Epworth United Methodist Church Gaithersburg C498 10/23/2020 First Methodist Church Colleyville Texas C540 10/23/2020 First United Methodist Church of Carrollton C507 10/23/2020 First United Methodist Church of Shelton C489 10/23/2020 First United Methodist Church, Victoria C487 10/23/2020 Flat Rock First United Methodist Church C518 10/23/2020 Gashland United Methodist Churdch C547 10/23/2020 Glen Burnie United Methodist Church C475 10/23/2020 Goodrich United Methodist Church C481 10/23/2020 Grace United Methodist Church C496 10/23/2020 Grace United Methodist Church C508 10/23/2020 Grace United Methodist Church C552 10/23/2020 Grace United Methodist Church C24 10/23/2020 Holiday Park United Methodist Church (98585) C529 10/23/2020 Holiday Park United Methodist Church (98585) C513 10/23/2020 Homestead Park United Methodist Church C20 10/23/2020 Homestead Park United Methodist Church (103240) C517 10/23/2020 Hudson First United Methodist Church C530 10/23/2020 Katonah United Methodist Church C499 10/23/2020 Kensington United Methodist Church C476 10/23/2020 Lone Oak United Methodist Church C478 10/23/2020 Marysville United Methodist Church C484 10/23/2020 Michelson Memorial United Methodist Church C510 10/23/2020 New Life United Methodist Church C509 10/23/2020 New Milford United Methodist Churcg C495 10/23/2020 New World UMC Arlington Texas C477 10/23/2020 New York Annual Conference of the C500 10/23/2020 Newington United Methodist Church C514 10/23/2020 Nolensville First United Methodist Church C488 10/23/2020 Oscoda United Methodist Church C539 10/23/2020 Pearl Street United Methodist Church C480 10/23/2020 Petoskey United Methodist Church C551 10/23/2020 Pleasant Street United Methodist Church C492 10/23/2020 Port Huron First United Methodist Church C493 10/23/2020 Poughkeepsie United Methodist Church C535 10/23/2020 Redeemer United Methodist Church C511 10/23/2020 Redford Aldersgate UMC C28 10/23/2020 Ringgold United Methodist Church (85845) C536 10/23/2020 Ringgold United Methodist Church (85845) C21 10/23/2020 Roxbury St Paul United Methodist Church (187944) C522 10/23/2020 Roxbury St Paul United Methodist Church (187944) C503 10/23/2020 Saint James UMC of Kingston C490 10/23/2020 Saint Pauls United Methodist Church C23 10/23/2020 Salem United Methodist Church (96644) C528 10/23/2020 Salem United Methodist Church (96644) C526 10/23/2020 Severna Park United Methodist Church C502 10/23/2020 Shepherd United Methodist Church C485 10/23/2020 Simpson United Methodist Church C22 10/23/2020 South Greensburg United Methodist Church (98643) C525 10/23/2020 South Greensburg United Methodist Church (98643) C491 10/23/2020 St. John's United Methodist Church C506 10/23/2020 St. Paul United Methodist Church C27 10/23/2020 Summit Chapel United Methodist Church (97502) C534 10/23/2020 Summit Chapel United Methodist Church (97502) C524 10/23/2020 The First United Methodist Church of Lowell C543 10/23/2020 The United Methodist Church of Peekskill C516 10/23/2020 Trinity Boscobel United Methodist Church C504 10/23/2020 Trinity United Methodist Church C29 10/23/2020 Trinity United Methodist Church (188061) C537 10/23/2020 Trinity United Methodist Church (188061) C538 10/23/2020 Trinity United Methodist Church (188061) C26 10/23/2020 Unionville United Methodist Church (96861) C532 10/23/2020 Unionville United Methodist Church (96861) C523 10/23/2020 United Churches of Durham C533 10/23/2020 United Methodist Church at Shrub Oak C519 10/23/2020 United Methodist Church of Babylon C515 10/23/2020 United Methodist Church of Bay Shore C544 10/23/2020 United Methodist Church of Sea Cliff C497 10/23/2020 United Methodist Church of Watertown C494 10/23/2020 West Hartford United Methodist Church C486 10/23/2020 Westwood United Methodist Church C550 10/23/2020 Wethersfield United Methodist Church C555 10/24/2020 First United Methodist Church, Ansonia, CT C554 10/24/2020 Fishkill United Methodist Church C556 10/24/2020 Fishkill United Methodist Church C559 10/24/2020 Grace United Methodist Church C553 10/24/2020 Iglesia Evangelica Metodista Unida de Coop City C560 10/24/2020 Montgomery United Methodist Church C561 10/24/2020 Mt Zion United Methodist Church - Highland, Md C557 10/24/2020 Naugatuck United Methodist Church C558 10/24/2020 Trinity United Methodist Parish C39 10/26/2020 Armagh United Methodist Church (97227) C40 10/26/2020 Baden United Methodist Church (95263) C46 10/26/2020 Bakerstown United Methodist Church (95285) C36 10/26/2020 Calvary United Methodist Church (100543) C52 10/26/2020 Christ United Methodist Church (89227) C47 10/26/2020 Fells United Methodist Church (99660) C48 10/26/2020 First United Methodist Church (103546) C53 10/26/2020 First United Methodist Church (103980) C51 10/26/2020 First United Methodist Church (180908) C44 10/26/2020 First United Methodist Church (85787) C34 10/26/2020 First United Methodist Church (89901) C30 10/26/2020 Glenwood United Methodist Church (60674) C42 10/26/2020 Greenstone United Methodist Church (101148) C49 10/26/2020 Haven Heights United Methodist Church (Pitt) C41 10/26/2020 Lakeside United Methodist Church (85388) C43 10/26/2020 Lakewood United Methodist Church (89307) C54 10/26/2020 Latrobe United Methodist Church (98120) C33 10/26/2020 Monroeville United Methodist Church (98324) C38 10/26/2020 Mount Lebanon United Methodist Church (101308) C45 10/26/2020 Nixon United Methodist Church (95503) C50 10/26/2020 Otterbein United Methodist Church (189475) C31 10/26/2020 Stone United Methodist Church (89626) C35 10/26/2020 Stone United Methodist Church (89626) C37 10/26/2020 Trinity United Methodist Church (100554) C32 10/26/2020 W. PA Annual Conference of the C55 10/26/2020 West View United Methodist Church (102245)
  17. Actually it could be viewed the other way, National is throwing the COs under the bus. The Charter Agreement states, "Provide primary general liability insurance to cover the Chartered Organization, its board, officers, COR, employees, and Scouting members and volunteers for authorized Scouting activities. Indemnify the Chartered Organization in accordance with the resolutions and policies of the National Executive Board of the Boy Scouts of America.." This needs to come up in the bankruptcy and abuse settlement. National took on this responsibility to the COs, they need to be held responsible. And of course, the insurance companies the BSA used should be held accountable for paying these claims.
  18. My spouse recently started in SM position. The dilemma is that the SPL and ASPL are both very concerned about COVID and do not want to have meetings. It sounds like the objections are -- can't meet in person, can't meet outside, it's getting cold, Zoom meetings don't work. So, there is no momentum at this point and my spouse wants to honor youth leadership but not have troop life grind to a halt. The Troop skipped summer camp due to COVID fears. They've attempted small patrol meetings in a park, and they had a very brief outdoor court of honor. But, it is very hard when the youth leadership does not want to meet. Any suggestions? Thank you. Side note that many in the Troop got together for an Eagle project and Eagle court of honor. There is another Eagle COH coming up. So the fear seems to be uneven.
  19. Yesterday
  20. I do have mixed feelings, but it doesn't put me in a conflict of interest, since my loyalties are entirely with the CO. I have always been clear about that. I can understand how some people might feel differently.
  21. This would explain why the Florida Methodist Churches came in recently. Remember how I previously said that this does NOT end with BSA liquidated because the Congressional Charter will save the shell? Yeah, now more than ever I believe that. The COs will throw national and especially the Councils under any and all available buses. National and the Councils are going to lose every tangible asset.
  22. Just poking around a bit. https://www.mississippi-umc.org/newsdetail/united-methodist-churches-and-boy-scouts-of-america-14335626 https://www.gnjumc.org/the-boy-scouts-of-america/ https://www.gnjumc.org/the-boy-scouts-of-america/statement-on-boy-scout-bankruptcy-from-gnj-chancellor/
  23. Ok, now that's even more curious. Why would you have conflict of interest? Between your unit and your CO/Church?
  24. I've received more information and I see why you said that. I just realized it will put some of us in a conflict of interest situation.
  25. Yes, but I can't share them with you.
  26. I have not, but I shared the Baptist link above to my IH/ASM (don't ask, he wants to be an ASM and not the IH/COR/CC). He will be going up through his hierarchy.
  27. Just received a statement from state annual conference of United Methodist Church regarding child sex abuse. It noted that the BSA has filed for bankruptcy, "which limits their exposure to lawsuits and may increase the church's exposure." It further adds that the conference leadership in consult with its lawyers as well as conferences around the country is taking "appropriate steps". It additionally notes that the UMC has more scouting programs in its buildings than any other denomination. I guess that's maybe true after the LDS departure. It seems a very measured statement but still concerning. I haven't yet seen anything like this through Catholic or Lutheran church ties. Has anyone else seen similar statements from them or other religious denominations?
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    • Just a reminder, our bankruptcy is because BSA waited way too long to install hearty youth protection from abuse.  Many of us (myself included) used to laugh at that … then a co worker of mine, an Eagle Scout and Vigil Honor member, got to visit Club Fed for child pedophilia.  I remember calling the Council Director of Support Services as the word of the arrest (it was at work and public) filtered through our workforce.  When I got him, he had been tipped off by the US Attorney, and was already preparing the severance letter. I've never laughed about YP since.
    • The fears are real and founded.  We need to be empathetic to the kids.   In my experience, what is needed is to pose the problem of not having meetings being a problem that needs to be solved.  Let them know the problem and maybe even some solutions that have worked for other units.  Ask and listen to their ideas and solutions.  I am not doubting that your husband is already doing this BTW.  In my experience if they feel they own the problem they will come up with a solution that they will fight for. We are much smaller than a troop but we have been able to meet in small groups, masked, socially distanced, and activities following CDC guidelines. Zoom meetings every so often.  So I don't pretend to say our situations are the same.  but there are ways forward.  All our units are hurting and recruitment is almost impossible.  Honestly the biggest problems with people following guidelines have been the adults complaining and not following them.  I pull them aside and have private conversations, normally there is denial and grumbling but they come around. Here are things I have seen that have worked: Small group camping, youth stay in their own tent. Hikes, masks on whenever they are six feet or closer. meetings in camp chairs in a circle chairs six feet apart learning a scout skill.   Playing scout games like charades.  canoeing, sailing, bicycle rides Just some ideas.  good luck
    • A hike or a bike ride are both great ideas. Do keep in mind temps are dropping below freezing at night, thus beginning the winter cycle, as far South as Kansas City to St Louis.  Be prepared
    • I live here in Kansas City, and used to know a National VFW player in their youth serving support.  Regrettably he has since passed, but I think you'll find VFW National will be informing VFW local Posts.  Cannot speak for other organizations.
    • I agree. There is so much ill will that could be created here among so many community groups that I don't see how scouting in any form could withstand it. Scouts is in another impossible situation but the fact that COs have had, as far as I know, practically no direct communication from National on this as it developed has probably been alarming to the ones who have been paying attention. What will happen to the ones who aren't paying attention and don't file a claim and wind up suffering losses?  The Methodist church makes out OK but the AME church or VFW down the street does not? Whose moral responsibility is it to tell them to file by Nov. 16?    
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