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    • I have been reluctant to reply as I was unable to attend NOAC.   I did however have a long conversation at last weekends Vigil inductions with a friend who has been performing / advising ceremonies  for over 40 years, and has often served as a NOAC  judge as well.    It seems there was a one hour seminar devoted to this subject, that ran almost three hours. So as best as my sleep deprived brain can recall...  National was receiving 4-6 phone calls or emails a month complaining of cultural theft.  That's 48-72 per year out of how many thousands of AoL ceremonies?  But this is National.    They seem to panic at any negative press now days.   So they decided to rework it and take it out of local hands.    The first draft was written by the two guys who rewrote the Brotherhood Ceremony a few years back.  Then it was handed off to the Cub Exec Committee.   Which is why, I guess,  it is such a " lame, corny " skit.  As well as a rather shameless plug for expensive high adventure camps.    The attendees were assured that there is no plan to change anything else.   Callouts, Ordeal, Brotherhood, and Vigil will remain as they are. Of course there was " no plan to let girls into Boy Scouts " either. Call me cynical  Oldscout PS.  So far, every scout on my team wants to go with a Standing Bear Productions  LLC model    
    • I apologize for suggesting a course of action that circumvents appropriate protocol. Obviously I'm ignorant of the Committee side of things and therefore shouldn't have put those 2 cents worth out there.
    • Again I'm not a lawyer, but is there implicit defamation? Say one applies to another youth organization and is asked, 1. Have you ever been rejected to serve in a volunteer organization? 2. If so why? I imagine the honest answers, Yes and I dunno would only add another rejection.
    • One of the better references that I've read was from a scout's older sister!
    • It ramps up from the end of bear through boy scouts pretty steadily. Webelos are expected to camp as a patrol away from parents and to do so more frequently. Then scouts BSA is much more independent and camping oriented. I suspect part of the problem is finding a program that meets the needs of all the different groups across the country.
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