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Order of the Arrow

Discussions for OA Members and those interested in Scouting's Honor Society. Also includes a private sub-forum for OA Members only.


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  1. Western Region

    Sections, Lodges and local discussions

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  2. NOAC

    Been to NOAC? Heading there? Chat about the Order's bi-annual gathering

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  3. Central Region

    Sections, Lodges and local discussions

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  4. Northeast Region

    Sections, Lodges and local discussions

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  5. Southern Region

    Sections, Lodges and local discussion

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  1. SM approval? 1 2

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  2. National chief

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  3. Broken Arrow Ceremony

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  4. Lodges Merging

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  • LATEST POSTS

    • I really want to reply point by point.  I really do.  The article is inflammatory and one-sided.  I'll select a few...   * "few Americans had the collection of reports on pedophiles that the BSA had in its file cabinets." ... Every major school district.   Every major police force.  Major teaching organizations and medical professions.  Aggregate these into national federations and associations.  ... Simply google "2022 school teacher sexual abuse"   ....  If those organizations did not have the files, it's because they choose to not take it seriously or that it was dangerous to track.  ... The trained, credentialed professionals whose professional job is to help and protect youth.  ... Then, consider the numbers.  ... LA Times said 5000 IVF files from 1947 to 2005.  That averages less than 2 per year per state.  BSA membership was steady for decades at 5 million youth members and 1 million adult members per year.  .... A single case is unacceptable, but the IVF numbers don't paint a picture of BSA having unique numbers.   ... Even the 80,000+ numbers in BSA's bankruptcy seem drastically under-reported compared to the statistical expectation we'd expect to see in society.   * "No one, therefore, reported the cases to the BSA's health and safety committee" ... Until recently, criminal activity of individuals was not viewed as a health and safety matter.  Drowning.  Gun safety.  That was health and safety.  Crime was crime. * "Thus uninformed, Menninger sat in a 1987 deposition" ... 1987?  ...  Uninformed? ... The same Patrick Boyle Scout's Honor book also pointed out that in 1986 BSA quoted Menninger in BSA's Scouting Magazine ... BSA communicating to it's volunteer scout leaders ... that "Child Abuse: A Critical Issue in Our Society," ... BSA quoted Menninger to it's volunteers saying all types of abuse is "much more prevalent than anybody would like to admit." ... The following month in 1986 BSA again had more in Scouting Magazine asking parents to address sexual abuse by those in authority.  ... page 273.  I'm not trying to say BSA was perfect.  ... But it's just ugly re-writing of history to say BSA was doing nothing.  It's ridiculous to say BSA had uniquely special knowledge about CSA.     
    • Is there a Facilities Use Agreement form that is used by all units sponsored by a Methodist Church or is it something unique to the dioceses within the states or even individual churches.   We are gonna need that.
    • Thank you so much for your quick answers and guidance, I am truly grateful to the experts here on this forum!  
    • I am reposting what I wrote earlier on the other thread: So in my profession of medicine, documentation is very important with time as the medical record has become much less about communicating the condition of the patient to other physicians and is mainly for medical legal and accounting purposes.  When I have reviewed one of my charts or been an expert witness, I am often struck about obvious omissions.   The mantra is if it is not documented, it was not done.  It is far too common to find a situation where I am certain that things were done but there is no supporting information.   Lawsuits can turn on such evidence. In reading some of the IVF that have been released, it is clear that little was documented.  We can infer that more was done than was documented but cannot prove it.   So in some cases, proper steps were taken and there wo7ld have been little ways to have detected the perpetrator before the incident.  In those cases, the BSA could have done as well as could be expected in that time but lacks documentation to prove it. Then there are cases like some have shared with us in these forums when the BSA had warning signs and even knew of potentially abusive situations and failed to act.   There is no way to paint a happy face on these situations - the BSA failed the Scouts.  In the former cases, the BSA could not prove that it did the right thing. I have no idea how many cases would fall into either category and in some ways, it does not matter.  All of us failed those Scouts. From what I have seen, the BSA has tried to prevent abuse and seems to have done far better than other youth serving organizations.   While that is comforting that we as the volunteers have done better than other groups, it does not exonerate us on our failures.  So the survivors deserve our concern and care.  We must say that what happened was not acceptable and that we are all dedicated to making Scouting as safe as we can possibly make it. A survivor who feels that the BSA is not redeemable needs to be understood.  Had I been abused as a boy, that could well be my attitude and if we are all honest with ourselves, could apply to many of us. Doing better than others just says that we did not fail as badly as others. I believe that Scouting has been beneficial to far more Scouts than it has harmed so I hope that it survives.  It should survive only if we as volunteers can make it far safer than it has been.
    • This chart really stood out to me.  Kind of weird language for the discussion.  
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