Questions you might ask a Lad who quit Scouting?

No there are no missing smiley faces.

What would you ask a Lad who quit Scouting?

What would you do in order to get him back in the program?

Eamonn

What are you going to do with your time now?

If they have an immediate answer then I might dig for what they didnt get from Scouting. If they do not have and answer or one that really means nothing then I would wish them good fortune and not waste my time.

Actually Oz, this might be a cultural thing but I would think in opposition to you. If a kid tells me he quit scouting because of other committments, spors, band, theatre,etc. and then said they loved those areas more than scouts, I would let them go after trying to see if a compromise could be worked out.

If a scout quits "just because" and has no plans, then I would dig because then there may be a problem in the Troop that is being unsaid. Kids want to be invovled in something, but it has to be something they like, so I would want to find out why they dont like scouts

I can remember the conversation with one young man. He stopped coming to meetings. He was a good Scout and he was missed. I visited with him and his parents. They were somewhat defensive but I wanted him to know that he was missed. He had been a part of the school band program and it was then taking a larger share of his time. He also wanted to play basketball. I let him and his parents know that Scouting was a program that lasted all year. They were told that that if he wanted to return that he could join back in any time. He did not return. He had been given every opportunity to evaluate and to plan the program that was presented to him but it was not enough or it did not meet his needs. We had other Scouts with similiar choices and they were given the same opportunity and many responded postively and remained. Scouting is a choice and it is second to non but we gave every indivdual the opportunity to define themselves and to pursue their idea of happiness.

The age of the Scout is important here. Is this a new Scout 1-2 years with the troop, or, has the boy been around for more than 2 years (maybe 3 years).

If its a new Scout, Im not sure that this question can be asked without looking back on how the Webelos Scout transition was handled. Did the boys who were CS together move together into BS, or, did the boy move to BS all by himself because someone (something) sold him or his parents, on a troop that was 15 miles away?

If its an older Scout, the questions' are in some ways harder to get a good answer for. If the boy was the subject of some bullying by the older boys, you may never get the answer. Perhaps the boy just couldnt deal with wearing a uniform any longer, he probably wont tell you that either!

If the boys is (was) into scouting, and left the program you can be pretty sure that the reasons are profound or at the least embarrassing to the boy. This is not to say that something inappropriate happened, probably just kid stuff. But answer wont be found in the standard questions about other activities, school, and family.

I agree with OGE. If a boy just decides he likes something more, and is more interested in committing his time there instead of Scouts, I think wishing him well and making sure he knows the door is always open is appropriate. The first question I ask is what the boy plans on doing with his time that used to be spent on Scouting. If he doesn't have an answer, or if it's video games or T.V., I push pretty hard to get down to an answer.

I think we have to face facts that Scouting will not interest every boy. And a different Troop might be more interesting to a certain boy than mine. If we can help the right Troop find the right boy, both can benefit. And it just might be that Scouting isn't going to give a guy what he needs to stay interested. If I know a boy is leaving because of another interest, I feel fine. If it looks like it was the program, I start looking very hard at what we are offering. When it's one guy, maybe it isn't us. If it's two or three guys all near the same time, I've got to investigate.

We've had two intances where a group of guys quit about the same time. In one, the root cause seemed to be an ASM who was the Den Leader for the entire group that crossed. He insisted on treating this group like Cub Scouts, even after many attempts to get him to stop. Eventually, he took 5 of these guys and went to another Troop. We feel no sense of failure for this group, although it is sad that none of the five are still in Scouting. The other time, we had an SPL that saw the Troop as his own little fifedom, and each of the newest kids as his personal servants. The adults (me included) hadn't been monitoring things closely enough, because all seemed to be going smoothly. A rash of quittings made us check things out and get them corrected. This was a tough time for us, as it meant more direct adult involvement than we usually have. But two of the four kids did come back, and are doing fine now. The other two loses we feel are directly our fault, and feel horrible about them.

Mark

I became a Scoutmaster because my son was moving up to Boy Scouts from Cubs. I was ask to start a troop.

I had a great program, I thought everything would be great, but soon my great program began to fall apart. Why? because I had real conflict with ASM's who wanted to do everything there way, little by little, but they did not want the responsibility of SM. They favored their scouts from cubs and this caused problems with others.

My son had conflict after contflict with their click, the others just quit. Trying to change this group was imposible. The ASM's never saw the big picture. I left the troop simply because neither my son nor I were haveing fun.

It left a bad tast with my son, sure it would have been nice to get rid of those in the click, but that woulden't work.

I'm still in scouts as an ASM with another troop, and my son...well maybe, the main thing the boys like to do is have fun. I have found that the one answer to the question asked a scout why he quit is "He wansen't having fun" no matter the program if they are not having fun they won't stay.

It's still the same "Fun with a pourpose" if it's not being delivered. The scouts will leave.

I'd ask him why he left. I have asked why to a few boys, or I know of instances where other leaders have asked. In Cubs, we had a situation that was bullying, and that prompted my son to want to leave--and he loves Cubs. So, bit by bit, I addressed the issue with the appropriate people, and he has remained and is happy. I know of boys who left (in the past year) the troop or pack because: (1) sports was more important, (2) family obligations, (3) bullying (all of which has been resolved), (4) leadership (resolved), (5) boredom (working on that). If the boy gives a reason for leaving that is not related to Scouts, then it's out of your hands. If it a reason that involves the pack/troop, it needs to somehow be addressed. What his reason is will have much to do with how you respond. Eamonn, good luck working this out.

As a District we now have a member of the Membership Committee tracking the Scouts who opt out. 2003 was the start so there are a lot of things that need to be worked out. Mostly to do with the timeline. As a District we have to wait to see who isn't on the charter that was on the last charter. So we don't know when the Scout opted out. We are doing this by phone which is not ideal. But we don't have the manpower to visit each Scouts home.

Some people are asking why are we doing this? I happen to think that it is easier to keep a customer then find or recruit a new one.

Most of the reasons given for quiting are due to band or sports. This year we aim to send these Lads a letter that tells them that they can do both.

One thing that I find very disturbing is when asked if anyone from the troop had been in contact with the Scout or the family the answer is no. While we still have a long way to go. Last year/this year we managed to get six Scouts back into the program. Five of them back in their "Old Troops." All the Scoutmasters were happy to see these Lads return and there as far as I could see were no ill feelings. In fact it seemed to work out well for everyone.

Eamonn

No OGE I dont think that our difference here is cultural. Rather I have become less able and less willing (separate issues to me) to pursue every Scout in achieving their ultimate happiness.

The kids I am thinking of who do not have other plans want to stay at home with mum (sorry if that bites a bit) and be served upon without needing to do anything substantial. If they persist with Scouts until they grow out of that then we have a success but most find saying nah easier than saying I will.

I recall the last meeting of last year. The highlight for 20% of the Troop was when the two Scouts I had bent over backwards for did in fact leave. Best nights of the year they said!

My worry OGE is that my ASMs are less dedicated than they indicated and both the programme and my knowledge of individual Scouts is slipping as the job is getting more than I can handle. This will cause withdrawals unless I can get more ASMs (replacements) and figure out how to meet their needs in the job.

I see that (following advice I recieved from this forum two years ago and chose to put aside) I must be SM to the Troop not just to individuals. Therefore if they have no specific reason for quitting then I have no specific reason to help them find reasons for staying. The effort does not justify the result as they need so much attention and often are really just unmotivated / self indulgent / not backed by parents etc that I can do little or nothing to address. Reality bit me here a while ago.

This is given that I know each and every Scout well. I am rarely surprised by a Scout wanting to quit. One did a few weeks ago (the first this year). No warning except that I never met his parents despite phone calls and seeking them out at pick up time. He loved it but his parents see other interests as more likely to get him fame and fortune. (He will get both regardless - he is a great little bloke)

So no I do not agonise over every Scout who disappears. Some I do because they are forced to quit (alcholic mum / parents have withdrawn 4 Scouts in last two years) but what can we do there?

I am lucky in having a small Troop (19 at present) and I am sure that I am on top of the disincentives. They are addressed in PLC generally with surprising success. I also talk to parents a lot. One has told me that his daughter will leave at the end of this year. No surprise - we discussed her in detail many times over the years and have exhausted ideas (mum is the key here).

Any one else have parents explain their marital difficulties in bold terms when doing the SM - parent talks?

Well Oz, One thing about Scoutmastering that is common the world over is that you can only do the best you can and each Scoutmaster has to decide for himself where to spend his time. The Scouts who stay in your Troop should count themselves lucky.

I'm going to bring myself here for all you as a scout who has experienced what you are trying to figure out first hand.

I joined scouts with 4 other Webelos, we stayed in the troop for some while. Then, they started to drop out one,because because he couldnt hack the situations, couldn't deal with being away from home. Another droped out because he was in to satisfy his parents. Another droped out because he felt like the little kid of the troop and didnt like being with older scouts, not bullying. And the other dropped out because of an adult. Then it was me. I didnt drop out, but I did stay out for two months. I then realized that I had no fun sitting at home on Monday nights, and that I had actually made friends in Scouting. So I decided to come back, and it was the best decision I ever made. I went to White Stag JLTC, earned many awards, and am an Eagle canidate.

Now some of you say that they are embarrassed to tell you why the dropped out. For one, your an adult. I know and have experienced that kids dont like to talk to adult about there problems in scouting, even though it is the best thing they just dont. Rather, they would rather talk to their best friend about it. Advise, get one of your older scouts to talk to them about it, that you KNOW for a fact doesnt even hint to bullying, and then you can most of the time get a result. When the ADULTS ask kids questions about that require their personal response, they usually DONT'T get a response, but when a fellow SCOUT asks them, you usually DO get a result.

And a child shall lead them...

Very Good SPL15, Very insightful