When & How I realized I was gay...

In response to EdMori's question...

Ed -

Sexuality is not just about sex or physical attraction, so there was no specific epiphany or event.

Also, I wasn't around any gay people when I was young; I had no idea what real gay people were like, except a surreal imagery to which I knew I would never relate. I had no external references to help identify the feelings I was experiencing, or the direction my life could take in that regard.

As puberty hit, and I began to imagine myself as a "sexual being", the imagery in my head was just always gay, not straight. In middle school, when kids started "pairing up" (for those meaningful, weeklong relationships that we all experienced), I had "girlfriends", but I always felt more emotionally connected to boys (something that continues to this day).

I dated some girls in high school, mostly because it was expected, and because by that time I was trying to dismiss the attraction I felt to boys as "just a phase". In retrospect, that "phase" seemed to last from about 12 to 24, with no real interruption. I just never could understand the strong attraction my friends felt for girls, though I was good at pretending otherwise.

I'm a very confident person, in all aspects of my life. This one aspect - my sexuality - was an insecurity I struggled with from my earliest recollection. My same-sex attraction and experiences were hidden away, discounted as interstitial, and I continued to expect that "phase" to end by the time I was an "adult" and ready to have a family. No matter how much I wished it, that just wasn't happening.

I continued to delude myself, in various ways, that eventually this "phase" would pass. As I grew from young adult to adult, I focused intently on lots of other things in my life - work, friends, school, Scouting - all of which provided an excuse for why I was not focusing on a relationship with someone.

When I was in my mid-twenties, a 17-year-old Scout with whom I had formed a special, brotherly bond, went through a crisis. Although we were very close - and interacted through Scouting and family several times a week - this boy had no insight into my real sexuality, nor I into his.

In retrospect, he was living a life with which I was intimately familiar. Though dating a girl, and consumed by other distractions in his life - work, friends, school, Scouting - he was secretly struggling with insecurity, and had grown up much the same as me, hiding or denying his sexuality. No one would ever have "suspected" I was gay, and no one would have "suspected" that of him.

One day this boy attempted suicide, and his entire world was altered. So was mine.

Several weeks later, he confided in me what caused him to act so irrationally. As I listened, what I heard was a recount of my own life.

Sadly, even with this boy pouring out his heart before me - a boy that I loved like a brother and for whom I held such deep respect for years - even then, I was unable to admit to him just how much I could relate. Even then, I didn't acknowledge that I was gay.

But that did trigger something with me, and soon after I shared with him. It's hard to imagine that we entered each other's life merely by luck. The fact that we had formed such a brotherly bond - and mutual respect - without any knowledge of each other's hidden secret, was not solely by chance, I believe. My great regret is that I only provided validation for this boy AFTER his life reached a breaking point, and wonder if I could have been a more positive force earlier.

From that moment I began to admit the "phase" wasn't going to end, and more importantly, there wasn't a good reason to wish it would. I recognized just how silly I had been all those years, beating up my psyche.

My nature is to be "in control", and I wasted many years frustrated that I could not "control" whether I was gay or not. In the end, I came to realize I was focusing on the wrong thing... It didn't matter whether I was gay... I wasn't giving up control by admitting that. I had been giving up control by letting other people define me - by hiding away secrets about myself that really didn't need to be hidden.

tj: What a fascinating and revealing story. Also one which, even within the anonimity of the forum takes some courage on your part. Not to mention insight.

When I was younger, I studied psychology and sociology. I have never worked in either area professionally and haven't kept up with professional literature. My anecdotal evidence and things told to me by gay friends (of whom I admit I haven't had all that many - not that I knew of, anyway) pretty much follow what you have said. In my many years as a Scout leader I have encountered a few boys who were obviously gay when they were young and went on to be gay adults. I know in my heart that they were created that way for whatever reason, or at least became that way at an age so early that it would be hard to conceive that they did it willfully or willingly.

Common sense tells us that, especially in past years, the life of a homosexual was a very difficult one. It still is, certainly for teenagers. It has never made sense to me that any number of people would knowingly choose such a life, if they had any real options.

Unfortunately, the religious point of view of many Christians will prevent them from looking at this in any other light, and I say this not in condemnation of their religion, but just as an observation. I think one of the reasons Hawai'i is so tolerant of the gay lifestyle (my next door neighbors are an openly gay couple and no one thinks anything of it) is the prevalance of Eastern religion and the openness of Hawaiian religious tradition.

Of course, I've said before that I think the BSA is weighing the advantages and disadvantages and when the time comes that they lose more membership by continuing their policy than not, they will change the policy. I think we are some years away from that time, but not as many years as some may think.

In any case, I appreciate your sharing your story.

Thanks, tj, for that enlightening and revealing story. The more we hear of stories like this, I think the more we'll have people understand better what it means to be gay, and we'll realize that it's really no different than being straight in many ways. Of course, as Kahuna said, there will be those who's religious beliefs will prohibit them from being accepting of you. We have to respect their beliefs regardless of how wrong we thing they might be, and hope that BSA will eventually become more open in its policies.

It saddens me that there is a group within Scouting that would brand people with labels like gay or atheist for whatever reason, then try to keep them out or even kick them out.

These are people who need Scouting or can give to Scouting as much as anyone else.

Thank you for your story.

Thanks TJ.

..a 24 year old "gay" interacting with a "strong brotherly bond" toward a 17 year old and nobody's pedophile alert flag went up. Curious.

As a scouter and a profesional educator I see several things I have to question 1. G2SS rule of 4 was not followed 2. Any conversation you had with this 17 year old should have included "Have talked to your parents about your feelings?", "Have you talked to your school counselor about this?" and "Have you talked to your preist, preacher or youth minister about these feelings?" I realize you interest in this young person, but, by law, in my state, teachers, counselors, nurses and principals are required to report the kind of contact you had to the Division of Family Services who then decides the propriety of the contact. If I don't report and it becomes known that I had knowledge-I lose my license. I cannot make the judgement of the propriety they do. I, IMHO think you may have done this young man a disservice.

(This message has been edited by stlscouter)

stls,

Not sure why you think a "pedophile" flag should go up every time an adult gay talks to a young adult male. Should the "lesbian" flag go up every time an adult female befriends a young adult female? I don't know what you think happens when 2 people have a "strong brotherly bond"; I have a strong brotherly bond with my brother, and no state or federal laws are broken as a result. I have a strong brotherly bond with several of my close friends; once again, no state or federal laws are being broken, nor, for that matter, any sort of activity that anyone of any religious sect would consider "immoral". This automatic link between homosexuality and pedophilia needs to be identified for what it is, part "old wives tale" and part homophobia.

It doesn't sound to me like this conversation was had within the confines of a professional relationship of the type you mention with counsellors, principals, teachers, etc., so those laws wouldn't apply. This sounds to me like 2 friends talking and confiding to each other. Whatever advice may be doled out in those kinds of discussions may be good or bad, but isn't illegal. What kind of friend would he be if he turned this friend away when he needed someone to talk to?

And, since we don't know if this conversation was held within the context of Scouting activities, we don't know if G2SS would apply or not.

stls - wow, you're really off the deep end. By definition, prejudice clouds judgment, and your conjecture shows how jaded your world view really has become. You go searching for evil just to assure yourself that you're sane.

While I shouldn't dignify your remarks, they are so baseless I feel compelled. For the record, no inappropriate contact or relationship ever occurred, and of course his parents were involved, as well as professional counselors. Was the seriousness of the situation lost on you?

Thank God his parents were as loving and supportive as they were... it could have been much worse had he faced parents that were ill-informed or bigoted.

No, neither Scouting or his priest was involved, because though both his church and Scout program had played huge roles in his life, he also acknowledged how significantly both entities compounded his angst. Today, years later, he is a happy person who ignores the prejudice around him in ways I still envy.

I will not go into further detail about this boy's situation. If you have a question or comment for me, on my personal situation, I'm happy to address it. I was asked how and when I knew I was gay, and I shared my story. I'm not surprised a few folks want to ignore my answer in favor of more conjecture and prejudice, though I do hope my story helps a few more Scout leaders or parents be prepared.(This message has been edited by tjhammer)

TJ. PS

Since the timeframe as to where and when the conversations took place and since the scouting format is where they met and since 17 yrs old is under the age of consent I see no reason I should be jumped on for the 3 points I listed. TJ your further explanation might have been useful in your first post. I do not consider the use of the word pedophile/homosexual to be interchangable No where in my post did I even suggest my personal belief concerning gay people etc.-you assume.

What I did say involves what I am expected to do under the circustances-and for me, my legal obligation. Incidently, even if a report is found to be "wihout basis" the record stays in a dats base for 5 years and if no further reports are made the record is sealed but not expunged. These reports also include reports of child abuse, neglect, endangerment harrassment and the like.