Announcement

Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.

Unit fundraiser at a location where alcohol is served?

Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse
X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Unit fundraiser at a location where alcohol is served?

    Got a question for the boards. Our unit is in the process of planning a unit golf tournament fundraiser. Already got an OK on it from local council. At a meeting the other night, it was brought up about alcohol on the course. The following applies to our fundraiser:
    1) The beverage and food sales are ran by the course and the unit gets no % of said sales as part of the fundraiser.
    2) The beverages would be offered via "beer cart" on the course that the golf course routinely opperates as part of its daily business
    3) We will be having a dinner afterwards, with auction, etc... only non-alcoholic bevs provided in the dinner. However, there is a cash bar in the resturant area of the venue and I could see some folks wanting to buy a drink and bring it into the banquet hall area with their meal.

    I understand the BSA G2SS guidelines that state: "It is the policy of the Boy Scouts of America that the use of alcoholic beverages and controlled substances is not permitted at encampments or activities on property owned and/or operated by the Boy Scouts of America, or at any activity involving participation of youth members." This property is not owned or operated by the BSA. We do not anticipate any of the youth 'participating' in the tournament, but were planning on having them serve as hole-greeters, judges for longest drive, closest to pin, etc... and be around at the diner to provide slide show and maybe MC the auction, etc...

    That being said. I have attended a couple "high-brow" dinners in my scouting days, a couple of times at the district level and once when they held the national meeting here. Big wig donors and key-note speakers type things in which there was a diner and if you bought your own "drink" at the bar outside the banquet hall, it was not viewed as a problem. These events, while not program 'for the youth' did have youth in uniform serving as color guard and on two occasions as the servers / wait staff or serving line attendants for the adults having dinner.

    My question is this: Are we running afoul of BSA policy if those that choose to participate in a charitable golf tourney drink on the course or at the dinner afterwards?

    I also think about the annual Scouts Night at the ballpark, where all scouts in the council come to the diamond in their unifroms. BSA doesn't ask the MLB stadium to stop selling alcohol at those games, while it does remind unit leaders and adults that it is a no-no to drink while in a BSA uniform. I know of units at both MLB games and NLF stadiums who have ran vending booths as unit fundraisers. Now, the booth the BSA unit runs cannot offer alcoholic beverages, BUT they can be sold by a seperate vendor right next door at the same event. This does not preclude the BSA unit from conducting a council approved fundraiser at the location.

    While I don NOT want to go looking for a reason to NOT have this fundraising opportunity, I also want to avoid any issues on the back end of the event. You can give your opinion about what you think is right in this situation, but what I'd really like advice on is WHO would you contact within BSA to get an answer? The SE at council? The district DE? Would you not ask and just beg forgiveness if someone brings it up as an issue after the fact? It seems to be kind of a grey area to me given what I have seen at past district, council, and national "adult leader" meetings in the past.

    Obviously, we do not want (and it would not be) a bosterious drunk fest. But at the same time, most guys I know that would be willing to shell out $100-$150 pp to golf in such an outing pretty much expect to be able to have a brew or two on the course. If we are forced to hold a "dry" event, I fear it would not be well attended and would likely be cause for us to reconsider the event altogether. Then I think of the local / national headline if someone were to get pulled over for a DUI coming out of a "BSA sponsored" golf tournament, and I second guess myself again.

    Got a question for the boards. Our unit is in the process of planning a unit golf tournament fundraiser. Already got an OK on it from local council. At a meeting the other night, it was brought up about alcohol on the course. The following applies to our fundraiser:
    1) The beverage and food sales are ran by the course and the unit gets no % of said sales as part of the fundraiser.
    2) The beverages would be offered via "beer cart" on the course that the golf course routinely opperates as part of its daily business
    3) We will be having a dinner afterwards, with auction, etc... only non-alcoholic bevs provided in the dinner. However, there is a cash bar in the resturant area of the venue and I could see some folks wanting to buy a drink and bring it into the banquet hall area with their meal.

    I understand the BSA G2SS guidelines that state: "It is the policy of the Boy Scouts of America that the use of alcoholic beverages and controlled substances is not permitted at encampments or activities on property owned and/or operated by the Boy Scouts of America, or at any activity involving participation of youth members." This property is not owned or operated by the BSA. We do not anticipate any of the youth 'participating' in the tournament, but were planning on having them serve as hole-greeters, judges for longest drive, closest to pin, etc... and be around at the diner to provide slide show and maybe MC the auction, etc...

    That being said. I have attended a couple "high-brow" dinners in my scouting days, a couple of times at the district level and once when they held the national meeting here. Big wig donors and key-note speakers type things in which there was a diner and if you bought your own "drink" at the bar outside the banquet hall, it was not viewed as a problem. These events, while not program 'for the youth' did have youth in uniform serving as color guard and on two occasions as the servers / wait staff or serving line attendants for the adults having dinner.

    My question is this: Are we running afoul of BSA policy if those that choose to participate in a charitable golf tourney drink on the course or at the dinner afterwards?

    I also think about the annual Scouts Night at the ballpark, where all scouts in the council come to the diamond in their unifroms. BSA doesn't ask the MLB stadium to stop selling alcohol at those games, while it does remind unit leaders and adults that it is a no-no to drink while in a BSA uniform. I know of units at both MLB games and NLF stadiums who have ran vending booths as unit fundraisers. Now, the booth the BSA unit runs cannot offer alcoholic beverages, BUT they can be sold by a seperate vendor right next door at the same event. This does not preclude the BSA unit from conducting a council approved fundraiser at the location.

    While I don NOT want to go looking for a reason to NOT have this fundraising opportunity, I also want to avoid any issues on the back end of the event. You can give your opinion about what you think is right in this situation, but what I'd really like advice on is WHO would you contact within BSA to get an answer? The SE at council? The district DE? Would you not ask and just beg forgiveness if someone brings it up as an issue after the fact? It seems to be kind of a grey area to me given what I have seen at past district, council, and national "adult leader" meetings in the past.

    Obviously, we do not want (and it would not be) a bosterious drunk fest. But at the same time, most guys I know that would be willing to shell out $100-$150 pp to golf in such an outing pretty much expect to be able to have a brew or two on the course. If we are forced to hold a "dry" event, I fear it would not be well attended and would likely be cause for us to reconsider the event altogether. Then I think of the local / national headline if someone were to get pulled over for a DUI coming out of a "BSA sponsored" golf tournament, and I second guess myself again.

  • #2
    hmmmmmm... just my opinion.... since it's been approved here's what I would suggest:

    a sign at the check-in saying something like: Alcohol is provided by golf club house only. If you drink please drink responsibly as Scout youth are around to help with their portion of the fundraiser.

    I would also suggest putting a sign by your dining area for those that go to the bar area that just says something like please confine drinking alcohol to the bar area as it is part of the club and not part of the Scout fundraiser.

    Just lets them know that it is there but is NOT part of your activity and may help participants keep in mind that there are youth there and help them keep their drinking more under control.

    Of course if do that you'd also want to make sure the club is ok with that.

    Comment


    • #3
      I wouldn't have any problem with this as described. I wouldn't expect the drinking to be a big part of the "on-course" activity, where the Scouts are present. Too bad you're not getting a piece of the on-course liquor sales, as that would increase your "take" considerably. I recommend really spicy Bloody Marys during rounds of golf.

      Comment


      • #4
        Not a problem in any case. Remind your leaders, however, that while they are assisting scouts, they should not be drinking alcohol.

        Comment


        • #5
          Did the local council know about the alcohol when they approved the fundraiser? Check the forms that were submitted to council. If the forms don't mention alcohol, you should contact the person that approved the application for guidance.

          Comment


          • #6
            This is not a problem. In my area it is a common fundraising practice for scout units (troops and packs) to run concession stands at professional sporting venues, including "beer only" stands, where the sporting team gives the units a cut of the proceeds.

            Comment


            • #7
              Relax on the alcohol folks. Just like guns and sex it isn't the vice its the people.


              So next time you see pictures of your next high dollar Council gathering take a sec and look at the tables in the background. Ya those are wine bottles. or the 1/4 full high balls.....yep bourbon.

              Our council has fundraiser nights at the local BW3 wings joint.......OH my gosh they sell liquor there.

              At the scout days at the pro baseball, soccer, football or hockey we see adults in scout uniforms drinking every time we attend.

              OR my favorite, Ducking out after the meeting at the mighty white clubs, Elks, Eagles or Moose, and having a beer after the meeting.

              While I am not promoting alcohol abuse or utilization in front of the boys.....It is a societal norm. I would rather prepare them for the real world opposed to keeping them locked up in a vacuum.


              For those I know who play golf, it is as much if not more about having a beer with the guys as it is chasing that white ball around a field. I wouldn't sweat it.....I think those that participate and pay high dollars for your event understand why they are there.......

              I would hit the golf course up for your share of the beer money.....


              Best of luck

              Comment


              • #8
                Does your Charter Organization have a position on this? Our local Catholic Troop would be cool with that as long as the libations were beer and wine, my Methodist Unit would feel uncomfortable with it but does allow participation at other events where we are not the main event.

                Comment


                • #9
                  The local town's summer celebration is sponsored by the troop's CO. They have a huge beer tent and the boys help sell at a separate booth, food products. The CO pays for all the boys' registrations out of these funds along with other financial support as needed. And of course in another room in the building where the troop meets is a full bar.

                  Been doing it for years and no one has mentioned it as a problem.

                  Stosh

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Years from now someone will be posting this same question about marijuana use as more and more states legalize it.

                    Comment


                    • dedkad
                      dedkad commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Tampa - Trails End Dime Bags! I can't stop laughing!

                    • gsdad
                      gsdad commented
                      Editing a comment
                      The munchies might help popcorn sales.

                    • King Ding Dong
                      King Ding Dong commented
                      Editing a comment
                      More likely to boost GS cookie sales.

                  • #11
                    Hummmm wonder how all those Units sponsored by Elks, Masonic Lodges, American Legions and other Organization which have Bars handle Alcohol and Scouting Issue. I Imagine by not selling to Minors

                    Comment


                    • FrankScout
                      FrankScout commented
                      Editing a comment
                      As an American Legion Troop, if the parents/leaders wanted to do a fundraiser at the Post with the bar open (no one under 21), such as a dinner-dance, they would be asked to run it as an event sponsored by "Parents and Friends of Troop XXX". Any planning would be done * outside* of troop or committee meetings, and the "group," chaired by a parent who is not a registered leader, would present the proceeds to the troop at a COH. In other words, the Troop itself would need to officially disassociate itself from the planning and execution of the event.
                      Last edited by FrankScout; 11-12-2013, 08:41 PM.

                    • qwazse
                      qwazse commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Frank would the scouts be allowed to participate by taking tickets, checking coats, or putting on a presentation or show?

                      Just curious.

                    • FrankScout
                      FrankScout commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Good question, the subject had never come up with us, as it was totally an adult-run function. I would think that a scout helping out with his parent present working at the function would be OK'd. (no uniforms!) Again, we (the troop and CO) would leave this to the parents to decide as parents, no "leader" involvement. We've only done a few of these over the years, mainly when our CO's building, the Legion Hall, burned down in the late 80's and the troop lost all of its equipment. The dances were a success, and the event goers were civilized and generous. The parent group was vigilant about not running afoul of BSA regulations and getting the troop in any kind of trouble.

                  • #12
                    From my own point of view ( in the UK) Alcohol is a fact of life, and at one time or other in life Scouts will encounter it.
                    Alcoholic drinks can be enjoyed, but must be treated with respect, and consumed in a responsible manner.
                    If Scouts see adults drinking responsibly then surely this sets a better example then making out that alcohol is a big bad thing or creating some sort of strange myth /taboo with regards to the consumption of alcoholic drinks.

                    In an previous post, IM_Kathy said
                    "a sign at the check-in saying something like: Alcohol is provided by golf club house only. If you drink please drink responsibly as Scout youth are around to help with their portion of the fundraiser"
                    Personally if that was me, I wouldn't bother with such as sign, as responsible drinking is something that should be expected from all adults present, failing to do that would be a major breach of trust.

                    Comment

                    Working...
                    X