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  • #61
    On the topic of the Bully using victimization to take the spot light off himself ...An apology to your shipmates is now public humiliation in front of your peers. A time out is also degrading....Forget that you put others at risk or damage occured. Loss of privledges is consider logical consequences in most cultures. In the world of the entitled child-this is very different because everything is negotiable in the home-and parents can even encourage this behavior because they feel these are good attributes.

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    • #62
      H2O ... I wish you the best. Scouting has some of the best memories for me, my sons, my family and, I hope, the scouts in our units.

      I very much sympathize with your situation. I have no good advice other than address things early and be very clear laying things on the line. Bad behavior has no place in scouting and it drives good kids away all the time. Scouting has boundaries and if a scout doesn't want to operate in those boundaries they need to find somewhere else to spend their time.

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      • #63
        EVERY time a new scout joins the troop they get the anti-hazing, anti-bullying, if you don't feel safe, tell someone speech. That's not just for the new guy, it's for the whole troop including adults. Needless to say, I've never had a serious problem in the troop and the minor ones get nipped in the bud right from the get-go.

        Stosh

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        • #64
          Originally posted by H2O View Post
          ... BTW-I'm a leader and also the COR.
          Then the letter should come from the Skipper.

          It's good that you all are sharing the leadership burden. But boys will be equally humiliated if they think they have to face down a committee of adults.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by JasonG172 View Post
            I dont know where this was ever determined HAZING. Hell we did it as youth, its just a stupid game like the cinnamon test or the new light myself on fire test. Its Kids being KIDS, let them be kids
            The problem with the "kids will be kids" approach is that in our case (see the 2010 post), it sent one of those kids to the urgent care. No, this is not "slug bug" or something else that is painful but relatively harmless. This can result in permanent injury. Would we react the same way if instead of "sack tapping" they were taking turns poking each other in the eye? Nope. This kind of thing is a serious issue requiring a serious response.

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            • #66
              There is some great advice here, I'll not restate it. However, I will say this:

              For both Troop and Crew this is not a unit issue, this isn't small potatoes. There's a very real possibility of dire consequences, criminal charges, law suits, loss of charters. Cut this young man loose from your programs, and let the BSA professionals and Charter Org handle things from there.

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              • #67
                Sending a boy to the hospital is a big deal. So is the groping of girls in his Venturing crew. This boy's exit is already overdue. I would not allow my son or my daughter to remain in an environment in which they are treated in this manner.

                As the mom of a Webelo considering whether or not he should progress to Boy Scouts, I look carefully at reports like these. I find it unimaginable that it happened at all, much less that any organization would consider keeping a member like this.

                If packs, troops, and crews continue bowing to kids like this, and their parents, soon this type of kid is all you will have left. Is this what you want Scouting to become?

                FYI, in my state (Georgia) we have a relatively new state law requiring that anyone working with children report suspected cases of child abuse to the police within 24 hours. Where I live, the troop/crew leader would not have the option of deciding whether or not to report it to the police. I don't know about the laws in other states, but it would be worth googling "mandated reporter".

                GeorgiaMom

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                • #68
                  A lot of this issue is also dependent on how one raises their child. My daughters were raised in a home where mom didn't want any guns or weapons in the house. Well, I had them. Today my daughters both have shotguns for home protection, one is conceal carry, if one wants their eyes scratched out, these are gals to mess with. Now that both are moms, I'd be even more careful. My children were not raised to be victims. If accosted, they will fight and fight to win.

                  I have two really neat granddaughters. Both who will be gun-safety trained by their grandpa.

                  In this day and age, it is not very wise to protect them from all the dangers this world has to offer, Instead it is best to teach them how to protect themselves from all the dangers this world has to offer. I can pretty much figure the police report will go something like, "Yes officer, I was attached by that bloody mess lying in the street over there."

                  While one doesn't go looking for trouble, sometimes it comes along and how one handles it confidently makes a big difference on how well they will do in life. One of my daughters lives in Chicago and she grew up in a small town in the Midwest. I asked her if she felt comfortable with it and she said, "No problem, I avoid problem areas and know how to take care of myself." I guess one can't ask for anything more than that.

                  I apply the training my kids got into that which my boys get in the troop. Because of this I have never had to concern myself with mandated reporter issues. Does that mean I don't have issues? Nope, but I don't report them, the boys do, it is how they protect themselves.

                  Stosh

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                  • #69
                    no wonder America has become a weak nation. the wussification of America continues.

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by dhendron View Post

                      The problem with the "kids will be kids" approach is that in our case (see the 2010 post), it sent one of those kids to the urgent care. No, this is not "slug bug" or something else that is painful but relatively harmless. This can result in permanent injury. Would we react the same way if instead of "sack tapping" they were taking turns poking each other in the eye? Nope. This kind of thing is a serious issue requiring a serious response.
                      Reading the 2010 post, I don't see why you needed a bunch of internet strangers to tell you that a guy who sexually harassed and groped crew mates should be kicked out. If I were an adult in your unit and you hadn't, I would've left until you were gone.

                      As far as the gravedig/rehash from the other week, wrapping up the basically harmless teenage game of nut tapping with false allegations of abuse is a big goofy conflation.; they're separate issues.

                      I wouldn't tolerate nut tapping if I saw it, but it's not a kick-this-kid-out issue by itself.
                      Last edited by Scouter99; 08-31-2014, 08:01 PM.

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                      • #71
                        Jblake47, good job teaching your daughters to protect themselves. My own daughter is in jiu jitsu.

                        I think your daughter said it best:

                        "No problem, I avoid problem areas and know how to take care of myself."

                        In my mind, a crew where girls are groped and the leadership does nothing is a problem area to be avoided. Ditto any group where a child is sent to the hospital and nothing is done.

                        I hope scouts can maintain a better environment than this for kids. How do you teach skills and values to kids when they don't even feel safe?

                        Ga mom

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                        • #72
                          In a crew where girls are groped and the leadership does nothing is not a problem. Just call 911 and file an assault complaint. At least the leaders will now have to do something about it. Like either stand as witness or explain the negligence of not supervising properly.

                          My people know up front that this solution in my groups is not an idle threat. If I learn of a girl or other boys being improperly assaulted and they don't make the call, I will. Once the police are on site, they can sort out the "he said, she said" issues. I also let the boys know that 14 and 15 year olds groping a 16 year old girl will be forever on the records as a child molester.

                          Needless to say, I have never had to deal with this issue in 40 years. Either I'm lucky or no one has had the guts to challenge my rule of safety first...

                          My reputation must really precede me. My wife and I were hosting a co-ed group in a large city on a youth convention. It was in a large city downtown hotel. I had a young man from a different group (same convention) approach me and ask if he might have permission to ask one of my girls out to dinner at the hotel and that if she accepted my wife and I were expected to attend the dinner as well. She said no, but I was totally impressed with this young man. Not many high school aged youth that operate on a class level as that.

                          Stosh

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