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  • #31
    SS, if you can successfully post this software you can post to Dropbox. Just download the installer, create the account, drag your files into the Dropbox folder, copy a link to the file and post the link here.

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    • #32
      SSScout the PM system is down. Private email is the way to go.

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      • #33
        'personal ken...'
        H'mmmm....I was thinking more in terms of personal 'Barbie'....

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        • #34
          >>For example a diest believe their religious duties amount to living you life governed by reason , well it's a little more complicated than that but you get the idea. They are also distinctly NOT atheist.<<

          While I have known leaders who put a lot of focus on being reverent (as opposed to zero focus) I’ve never know one to discount a family who teaches deism to their children. I’m not so sure that deism isn’t one of God’s way of creating a path to him directly, who knows. But what little deism I have witnessed certainly has application teaching that can be quantified with the law and oath. You can’t ask for more than that.

          Barry

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          • #35

            Originally posted by packsaddle View Post
            I have to ask, however, how would you identify an "esoteric" belief?
            Well in this case I meant is like "hard to understand" the point is I can't really know much about any religion unless I belong (or perhaps spent time studying it). For instance I've never been to a synagogue or spent any significant time talking to anyone of the Jewish faith about their faith. So there is no way I can judge whether or not a Scout is following his faith.

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            • #36
              A Scout is reverent, and does his duty to god. Where do the requirements state a scout has to be religious? If he believes himself to be a god and treats other religions with respect, he's got it covered.

              Stosh

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              • #37
                Like these guys Stosh...http://www.churchofsatan.com/? Quoting from their front page, "We Satanists are thus our own “Gods,” and as beneficent “deities” we can offer love to those who deserve it and deliver our wrath (within reasonable limits) upon those who seek to cause us—or that which we cherish—harm."

                Probably not a huge following that would be thinking about joining the BSA but based on many of the arguments in this thread would be good enough to meet the requirement of Reverent.

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                • #38
                  >>Like these guys Stosh<<

                  We had one in my troop. Nothing became of it because he had far bigger issues with his family.

                  Stosh, I don't recall ever seeing a SM try so hard to protect his scouts from the BSA religious aspect of the program. Why?

                  Barry

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                  • #39
                    Actually, I don't see that THAT is what jblake47 is trying to do. Maybe I'm just not reading him correctly.

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                    • #40
                      Maybe you right, so how do you interpret what he is telling the OP on how to handle his scouts?

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                      • #41
                        None of My BSA Units never forced Religion Upon me.
                        BSA has always left it up to the Individual to decide what "My Duty to God" and What "Reverent" is..
                        I was never forced to Say "Philmont Grace" nor have I ever been "Forced to attend a Camp Church Service" and Yet I have never been struck by Lightning...
                        Did I participate...Yes..I participated because I wanted too because I choose to be part of the BSA Program. I knew it would not Kill me to set an Example not because I was Forced to Participate.

                        I have been around Scouts who remained in Camp to watch " the Campfire" during Camp Services
                        I have been around Scouts who removed head gear and Remained Silent during "Grace"
                        and Yet I have never seen any of them Struck by Lightning either.

                        I find that individuals who do not want to follow BSA rules don't stick around anyways...Never Meet any Scout who attends events and advances who did not deserve it.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Eagledad View Post
                          Maybe you right, so how do you interpret what he is telling the OP on how to handle his scouts?
                          Well, I'm not so sure about what he IS trying to tell the OP. That's kind of confusing at this point. But he has always seemed to be devout in his beliefs and I'm very confident that he's not about to endorse Satan worship.

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                          • #43
                            The point being, if a scout is respectful of others and their religions and he himself operates out of some beneficial societal moral code, who are we to judge whether or not that "qualifies" as being a "correct" religion. If he's a Pantheist and sees "god" in all of nature and treats nature in a kind, loving way, why would we think he isn't doing his duty to god? Too many out there who seem to think that the spiritual aspects of a person's life has to be a specifically defined religion. That's not what being Reverent is all about.

                            If a SM is dictating that his scouts have to have a defined religion to qualify for membership in scouting, then that scout has the right to dictate to the SM that he live to the fullest extent of his religion as well. Good luck with that.

                            Being religious and being reverent are two different animals. Being religious/spiritual is for one's own benefit, being reverent is for other's benefit. Those that keep threads like this going on for page after page have a difficult time distinguishing between the two.

                            Stosh

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                            • #44
                              Been away for a bit during the summer.
                              I originally posted this question after a SM Conference. The rank requirements for 2nd and 1st Class state: Demonstrate Scout spirit by living the Scout Oath (Promise) and Scout Law in your everyday life. Discuss four specific examples (different from those used for Tenderfoot requirement 13 and Second Class requirement 11) of how you have lived the points of the Scout Law in your daily life.
                              As part of the conference I generally select a few points of the Scout Law and Oath for discussion, and upon asking about how he feels he demonstrates his Duty to God, he just said he believes nothing.
                              Since then I've given a couple of SM Minutes about having some sort of belief system, even if it's within one's self. That seems to sink in with them.

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