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2015 Webeolos changes

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  • 2015 Webeolos changes

    I'm trying to find more information about coming Webelos changes. Trying to learn if it is just my council or if it is BSA national.

    I am hearing starting in Sept 2015, Webelos becomes just a year instead of 18 months. The cross over changes from February (tradition) to September. I'm trying to see and learn what this means. The only reference to changes is in the attached link. I'm looking for more info to understand the changes.

  • #2
    My understanding is they are still working out things and prepping like crazy. I am guessing from some of the other links and stuff I've read is that A) Webelos will only be a year and B) Arrow of Light will be 6 months and won't require the Webelos badge to get.

    The links I've used have been posted on other threads on this site.

    Comment


    • #3
      The skinny I got is that the Arrow of Light crossover will be timed for November, not February, to get 5th graders acclimated with their troop at Fall Campouts and merge the process a bit. Webelos (4th grade) will end up more Cubbish in the process.

      Comment


      • dedkad
        dedkad commented
        Editing a comment
        So one would have to run a program the entire summer to get the 6-month AOL program done by November? My son's new troop has a campout planned this month, there's a District Camporee in May, and plenty of activities and meetings in between. I think he will be fully integrated come summer camp. Not sure what the rush is to get the boys moved up to Boy Scouts just in time for the holiday layover. And honestly, I really don't think sending your 10 year old off on their first camping trip without a parent to a snow camp is such a good idea.

    • #4
      Pet Peeve: Arrow of Light and Crossover are two separate things. Arrow of light is a Cub activity. Crossover is going from Cub Scouts to Boy Scouts. Yes, they are closely related in time, but they are TWO separate events.

      Comment


      • #5
        Personally, I think the first of the year would be the best time for crossover on the troop side.

        Comment


        • #6
          Personally, I was hoping Webelos would start meeting with the pack's aligned troop as the pack meetings are too immature now with Tigers and now Lion cubs (kindergarten age). IMHO, fourth and fifth graders would be much more likely to stay in the program if they had someone to look up to such as the boy scouts. And it would provide Boy Scouts "EDGE" opportunities by teaching the Webelos.

          Comment


          • dedkad
            dedkad commented
            Editing a comment
            I suppose you could say the same thing about the 1st graders being more likely to stay in the program if they had the Webelos to look up to.

        • #7
          All I can say is that the folks on the committees doing this are being very tight-lipped about it, except for promoting the Philmont Course that will cover all the changes. In fact, it appeared to me that some were surprised that Bryan on Scouting released as much info as he did.

          Comment


          • mashmaster
            mashmaster commented
            Editing a comment
            I wish they would just release the information. Holding it for Philmont training seems to me to be a way to get more people to go to PTC rather than prepare all of us that are going to need to adopt and run the new program. I have zero desire to go to PTC and sit in a room for a week on my vacation.

          • Eagle92
            Eagle92 commented
            Editing a comment
            Mash,

            I think part of the reason is that the PTB are still finetuning it. Hopefully it will be done better than wen Venturing came up in 1998.

        • #8
          IMHO Boy Scouts should stay in the middle school / high school age range. Let's not underestimate the mental maturity difference of 6th graders vs 5th graders. 6th graders are required to be independent. If the Webelos are bored, that is on their den leaders. Spring is a perfect time to crossover. The weather is not as severe. The scouts first camping experience can be more enjoyable. Making the new scouts winter camp will drive them and their parents away from scouting.

          Comment


          • SM bob
            SM bob commented
            Editing a comment
            Dedkad, was the maturity level in your den because you set the bar high? Did other dens before you have the same maturity level? Have you seen cubscouts transition to your troop where the scout and their parents were not ready?


            My sons Webelos group was ready early to transfer because we took then camping, hiking, and worked on scout skills. I have also seen Webelos den leaders that fail to understand that Webelos are not tiger scouts. They have never been hiking or camping but they have every belt loop. The BSA program is great except for the transition from cubs to scouts and from scouts to venture. I wish national would spend more time in that area.

          • Eagle92
            Eagle92 commented
            Editing a comment
            I can say that my old den who are now Boy Scouts, were pumped and ready to go. But I and my replacement as DlD had high expectations of them, and we started giving them more responsibility as Webelos 1s

          • dedkad
            dedkad commented
            Editing a comment
            oops, comment deleted. posted in wrong place.

        • #9
          I don't know anything about how it's changing, but I know in my den we got through about all the Webelo and AOL stuff in Webelo I and we spent the last 6 months not on specific achievements but on more fun stuff that was already checked off. We had winter campfire meetings with boys doing foil cooking a couple more outdoor meetings praciting building campfires without matches. We went on a some hikes, we went on two camping trips with the troop, a troop ski trip. Come crossover they were ready and they weren't bored because we were doing fun stuff. Yeah, there were more webelo pins we could have earned but we decided to focus on the stuff the boys enjoyed most. Our guys could have gone into the boyscout troop 6 months ago with no problems.

          Comment


          • dedkad
            dedkad commented
            Editing a comment
            Same here. We pushed pretty hard the first year of Webelos, so we could do mostly fun stuff the last 6 months.

        • #10
          We crossed in January, giving the boys 3 campouts BEFORE Camporee to learn their scout skills, etc. It was not that hard to get to AOL in 1.5 years. Then again, we do Blue & Gold at the end of the school year (in June for us).

          Comment


          • #11
            Actually it is doable to get AOL requirements, save the 6 months since completing 4th grade, in a year.

            Comment


            • #12
              The info I have from national concerning the changes in the Cubbing program will begin in May of 2015. There will be new books, The rank requirements will all change. Arrow points will disappear and belt loop will disappear. Webelos will still be a two year program with the first year being focused on the webelos badge and the second year focused on scouting skills. you will no longer have to earn the Webelos badge to earn the Arrow of Light. For more info talk to your district Advancement chair or your DE they all should have info you are looking for.by now. Every council should be having special training to to initiate the changes.

              Comment


              • #13
                I kinda liked the old program.

                Wolf
                Bear
                Lion
                Webelos

                As an introduction adding Tigers on the front was no big deal. Helps the membership requirements for councils and collects up more money with registration and uniform/awards sales.

                I never like the Webelos 1 and Webelos 2 designations. Lions and Webelos is better to understand.

                Arrow of Light is possible to get in one year in the Webelos program. I have done it and it's no big deal.

                My Webelos boys worked closely with their troop in obtaining their pins, AOL etc, and no problem with the Den to Troop transition. They already knew most of the boys in the troop when the crossed over. Because they had done their AOL requirements in the Webelos "1" year, they focused on the TF-FC requirements as an addition to the Readyman, Sportsman, etc. pins as Webelos "2". They ran rather parallel. Because the SM of the troop was working closely with the "new boys", when they crossed over into the troop they were awarded their TF badges along with book and necker. At that time, that practice was possible. I don't know if it is any longer. In reality these boys were basically all ready to go for their May camporee having crossed over after their February BG/AOL ceremony. They had 2-3 campouts before they reached summer camp.

                While I'm not advocating any of this, all I am saying is: It's possible.

                The trick to this whole thing? Have the Webelos boys meeting for 1/2 hour every week just prior to the troop meeting. This half hour was designed for event planning and pin requirements. Then they got to be part of the troop opening flags ever week and mingle a bit before they headed home. Announcements for the troop activities were always a part of the opening ceremony, so they got to listen in on all the fun stuff awaiting them when they would eventually cross over to the troop.

                Stosh

                Comment


                • jblake47
                  jblake47 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Used to be accepted back prior to 2000, don't know when it changed and it all depended on the SM as to whether or not he would accept it.

                  Stosh

                • Eagle92
                  Eagle92 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I remember AOL automatically gave you Scout badge and waived the the 2 month tenure requirement. But that ended in 1989 when they got rid of Skill Awards, youth on BORs, and time requirements for T-2-1.

                • dedkad
                  dedkad commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Then hopefully the new Webelos and AOL programs will eliminate the repetition, since they aren't recognizing the achievements at the Boy Scout level.

              • #14
                BSA has spent 20 years watering down the Boy Scout program, trying to make it for 10-14 year olds. Their attempt at clipping to top end of the program (Venturing) was botched. I'm guessing they're figuring six months to a year is as big a bite as the market can tolerate.

                Comment


                • #15
                  I'm thinking they are taking their time to get it right this time. They screwed up Venturing, and the Centennial Uniforms, so maybe the third time is the charm.

                  At least they brought back knee socks for the CUs, after I got 14 pair of the old style from the in-laws and my wife.

                  Comment


                  • perdidochas
                    perdidochas commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Besides the sleeve pouches, I like the Centennial uniform over the ODL uniform. The nylon pants are great. In FL, I have no use for knee socks.

                  • blw2
                    blw2 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    just curious... what about venturing did they screw up?
                    I recognize that it doesn't seem to have a huge amount of traction.... but what? why?
                    I'm a CS dad just thinking the venturing angle seems like where the fun is...... or could be.

                  • qwazse
                    qwazse commented
                    Editing a comment
                    The fun is everywhere a group of youth will gather to make something happen.
                    Enabling the fun around Venturing requires a tremendous effort on the BSA. More than what is expressed in curriculum revision committees and rollout of high cost high adventures.
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