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  • Knickers in a Knot

    The troop is hosting the Webelos on a campout this weekend at our council camp. This is a big deal for the troop and we go to a lot of trouble to plan a big weekend for both the Webelos and their parents. We make a point that the Webelos camp under Cub Scout camping guidelines which mean they have a parent or guardian with them who is responsible for them. (I know they could also camp as a Webelos den and be supervised by their den leaders, but that's not how we've organized the weekend.)

    So I find out that several of the Webelos parents have independently contacted the camp and reserved the staff cabins for themselves. The cabins are on the other side of camp, about a half mile away. No doubt their intention is to leave their Webs to camp with the troop while they get to check out for the evening.

    This just chaps my butt. I don't think there is a real safety issue here, but there are any number of policy issues if we wanted to get picky. Mostly, I'm irritated with being dumped on.

    Am I over reacting? How would you handle?

  • #2
    Personally, I'd let it roll off. I want the kids to experience what it's like to be a boy scout and the further the parents stay the better. I understand your frustration, having planned this all out.

    Comment


    • #3
      I think that's the best of both possible worlds. Parents aren't around to hover but are close by if johnnie needs to go home. I've always found that cubs are much better behaved without parents around and look up to the older scouts.

      Comment


      • #4
        I disagree with not wanting Webelos parents around for a visit, I wanted the parents to be just as impressed with our program as their sons. We had saying in our district, sell the kids, you have a 50 50 shot; sell the parents and you got a sure thing. That being said, I also would have been irritated. But then I remembered the parents are likely just trying to help out the troop by doing their reservations and not getting in the troops way. Tenting isn't everyones cup of tea (just ask my lovely wife), so the cabin idea is their easy solution. They just weren't thinking about logistics and troop schedule. Do the best you can with the situation Twocub and don't let it ruin today. Find a camp without cabins next year. Barry

        Comment


        • Twocubdad
          Twocubdad commented
          Editing a comment
          And that's a big part of the weekend. The Scout patrols put on some really cool Scout skill demonstrations designed to hook the Webelos (this year one of the patrols is showing how to treat zombie bites -- hint: it's the same as severe bleeding, compound fracture and rabid animal.) Meanwhile, I and the parents stand back and watch Youth Leadership in action. In the afternoon, we send the Scouts and Webelos off on a hike and the ASMs and I conduct a parent orientation with.

          You know, I suppose I need to count my blessings. While this isn't the example or precedent we want set, one of the moms is a real P-I-A. I may suggest she head off to her cabin sometime shortly after breakfast.

      • #5
        I guess I'm of the same opinion as others. Parents far away is not a bad thing. If they wish to come and check on how things are going and then disappear, fine. The alternative is having them hanging around getting in the way and hovering over their kid. I don't know if it's appropriate, but run a rope around the camp and it's activities and the parents can observe from the outside works for me. If that's a problem, run a rope around an area designated for observation and make the adults stay in there.

        Stosh

        Comment


        • #6
          I think it works.

          Ya it would make me mad. you go to the trouble of planning a nice dad and lad weekend and the dads are going to stay in a cabin.....I gotta ask, are the boys staying with dad in the cabin or in tents with the troop?

          Comment


          • jblake47
            jblake47 commented
            Editing a comment
            From the first posting, it appears that this activity is a Webelos trip to visit a Troop, NOT a Dad and Lad outing. If the Pack or Den wishes to set up a Dad and Lad, fine. But when it's a visit to the troop to check out Boy Scout activities, the dads are not part of the planned activities. The Boy Scouts take care of the Webelos boys and the SM and other adults may wish to converse with the parents, but it's not a joint activity.

            If this process was the normal routine, then one can expect helicopter parents to think this is normal that they hang around constantly in all boy activities. That's a floodgate I really don't want to open up.

            Stosh

          • Eagledad
            Eagledad commented
            Editing a comment
            Well we are just going to have to agree to disagree. Most parents that want to see a program in action for the purpose of picking a troop are not helicopter parents, nomatter how the program is presented. I would have concern of a troop where I as a parent were not allowed to see the program in action. It's also my personal opinion that troops shouldn't plan a campout specifically for webelos because they should observe a typical monthly program, but that is just me. Barry

        • #7
          I don't like people having their "Plan B" when I think my youth have thought of everything. But I remind myself that that's just me.
          The other silk purses ...
          1. You get an idea of the adults who really do love to tent camp, or at least are interested on how your boys operate from soup-to-nuts.
          2. You might get a sense of cubs who are prone to homesickness. It may mean your SPL or Guide will have to escort a boy to his parent's cabin, (or go fetch the parent), but by starting that relationship early might take the edge off summer camp.
          3. You might "check out", pay a visit to the parent's cabin, and explain your interpretation of "boy led."
          4. These parents might be the late-night card game type. Keeping them at a distance from camp may help calm things down.

          I hope this will work out for you.

          Comment


          • #8
            My only concern would be if this tells you something you don't like about the kind of parents they're going to be if their sons choose your Troop. It would be interesting to know what their thinking is about why they chose to reserve the cabins and not bother to tell you about it (or maybe they did tell you - that part's not clear to me). We normally take Webelos under Troop rules, not Cub Scout rules. A parent is welcome to come along, but not required. Webelos are expected to participate as though they were Scouts as far as boy-led - having a Troop Guide and so forth.

            Comment


            • #9
              Why don't you ask them what their thinking is since the weekend has been planned assuming their full participation? They may have rented the cabins so that after the campfire, they shuffle on home and get some sleep while the older boys stay up. Maybe they aren't as confidant of their WEBS foul weather experience and want a place to get them warm and dry fast. Maybe one of them has a medical or physical condition that makes it just easier to be in a cabin. Maybe it's their last hurrah as den parents. Ask.

              Comment


              • #10
                Parents dont understand boy led until they see it, feel it, and taste it. We never plan a campout around visiting Webelos. we have our agenda and if they come, they get pulled in to the program. Our visitors have experienced shooting sports, biking, rappelling, canoeing and what ever was planned a year ago at annual planning. The adults don't plan in the visitors, the patrol leaders are responsible for getting the families to the camp and taking care of them including food. Sometimes it's a day visit, most of the time it's a whole weekend. But let me say, the families can't get a better experience of boy run than visiting our troop. And it's rare that those families don't join. Barry

                Comment


                • #11
                  Please consider that a parent may have a medical condition. Personally, I use a CPAP machine that requires electricity overnight. Several other parents in our pack also use them.

                  I have tried all the methods of making my machine work on batteries so I can tent camp, and they just don't work for me. Yes, I can get the blower to work on a battery, but not the heater. I can't sleep with cold air being forced down my lungs.

                  Several years ago, I had a bladder issue after a car accident hurt my back. Can you imagine trying to deal with self-catheterizing in a latrine?

                  So, please be gracious. The parent may have a medical need for the cabin, so please respect their privacy. Even though I medically cannot sleep outdoors in a tent, I still want my son to be able to attend.

                  Why would it be anyone else's business if I choose to rent a cabin for myself with my own money? The snippy comments above about this making the troop leader mad, or being an indicator that the parent (and the child) will be a bad fit for the troop are very rude, judgmental, and out of line. In my case, your speculation would be way off base and invasive. If the parent's "Plan B" isn't costing you or the troop any extra money or trouble, then please mind your own business.

                  Georgia Mom

                  Comment


                  • Basementdweller
                    Basementdweller commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Maybe if your health is that fragile you shouldn't go with the troop?????

                    If it is for YPT then how is that accomplished with you in a cabin some distance from the troop? It is the troops business and impacts the youths outdoor experience.


                    Your excuses are just that.


                    I am a long time cpap user and Have camped using it my entire adult scouting career. I am not going to hijack the thread to discuss it. But you can do it, safely and comfortably. If your interested post up and I am willing to share my knowledge and what works for me.


                    If your going to use CPAP as an excuse, just stay home your a poor example to the boys.

                • #12
                  There are many reasons one cannot or is not comfortable tent camping. I must have my CPAP also, but don't use the humidifier so I can get by plop camping. I would have talked to the event coordinator about the situation, they did not. So talk to them about it as an adult and don't get upset until you know the circumstances and their reasons. A couple of months ago I took climbing and rappelling training and the group was expected to backpack to the cliffs about 3/4 of a mile. I talked to the chairman ahead of time and was given permission to plop back at the parking lot. I don't have a pack mule to carry a big deep cycle battery. Meant I had to hike a lot more than everyone else but was not a big deal.

                  Comment


                  • Basementdweller
                    Basementdweller commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I backpack with my cpap setup.....

                    Equipment choices are important.

                • #13
                  We like to make sure the parents camp away from there boys so I do not see this as a problem. I'd make sure to bring the parents in once or twice to have us talk to them and to check out the camp. I'd invite them to breakfast, opening flag and a quick talk. And a good campfire ceremony/antics. Let them stay out of everyone's hair most of the day would be great. Our problem is usually the opposite--clingy parents.

                  Comment


                  • #14
                    Originally posted by Twocubdad View Post
                    The troop is hosting the Webelos on a campout this weekend at our council camp. This is a big deal for the troop and we go to a lot of trouble to plan a big weekend for both the Webelos and their parents. We make a point that the Webelos camp under Cub Scout camping guidelines which mean they have a parent or guardian with them who is responsible for them. (I know they could also camp as a Webelos den and be supervised by their den leaders, but that's not how we've organized the weekend.)

                    So I find out that several of the Webelos parents have independently contacted the camp and reserved the staff cabins for themselves. The cabins are on the other side of camp, about a half mile away. No doubt their intention is to leave their Webs to camp with the troop while they get to check out for the evening.

                    This just chaps my butt. I don't think there is a real safety issue here, but there are any number of policy issues if we wanted to get picky. Mostly, I'm irritated with being dumped on.

                    Am I over reacting? How would you handle?
                    Irritated at being dumped on, but on the other hand, it's probably the best thing that could happen for the Webelos.

                    Comment


                    • #15
                      From what has been written here we don't know what the intentions are for the parents. They very well may plan on staying for the evening activities and head back to the cabins to sleep. Maybe they are planning their own campfire and bottles of wine, who knows. I have a hard time seeing parents wanting to spend all the time in a cabin without bottles of wine. . Make sure they understand BSA policies. With my wife's work schedule she has a hard time staying up past 9. If it bothers you that much pull out the GTSS and show them the Webelos are to be responsible to one adult. And that is not going to be you. I agree the best time to visit a troop is on a normal program activity. Last year my troop trotted out some older boys for the camporee that I have not seen since. However there are those pesky BSA guidelines limiting hat Webelos can and can't do.

                      Comment

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