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Who can remove a Cubmaster?

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  • Who can remove a Cubmaster?

    I'm trying to get an understanding of how a Cubmaster is removed from position. I've heard it must be agreed by the COR and Committee Chair. The question arises whether it is the Committee Chair alone or must it be decided by a majority vote of the Pack Committee? Since the COR is considered part of the Pack Committee, does the COR get another vote as part of the committee in addition to his own individual vote as COR? Thanks in advance.

  • #2
    No voting is necessary. Those who approve and sign adult applications are the ones who can remove people from those positions. Since both the CC and IH/COR sign the apps, I would say that the CC makes the recommendation and the IH/COR makes the decision.

    Comment


    • #3
      not too sure about that since Cubmaster precedes both COR and CC. If neither signed Cubmaste Application, how can he be removed by people who never had any say in his becoming Cubmaster in the first place?

      Comment


      • perdidochas
        perdidochas commented
        Editing a comment
        Because they have the authority based on their position. The COR is the official representative for the Charter Organization. Basically, the Charter Organization trumps anybody else on the choosing of CM (unless the proposed CM is gay/atheist).

    • #4
      Sorry for the double post...site is giving me problems this morning. My point was, those are the positions with the authority...doesn't matter who the people are at the time. It's like the CO of a ship...even though they change every 3 years, they are the ones with the authority to make decisions.

      Comment


      • #5
        Unit Committees don't vote. They are not intended to be "deliberative groups" (as we say in parliamentary terms). They don't make decisions, but each have something to do in supporting the unit.

        The COR acts on behalf of the IH, and THEY decide who the leaders of the CO's unit are. THEY have the power of 'hiring/firing", tho some may give that to the CC (or the COR may BE the CC).

        But the Committee has no say in that, despite what some think. I believe this is clearly stated in the literature, but not sure.

        Comment


        • #6
          More important than how is WHY would you want to remove a Cubmaster from the Pack during the program year?

          Comment


          • ChuckConnors
            ChuckConnors commented
            Editing a comment
            I could tell you the story, but it would be better if you waited for it to come out in paperback. It is The Most Unbelievably True Story You Will Ever Hear.

          • moosetracker
            moosetracker commented
            Editing a comment
            Removing as I read on I figured out this story to strange to be believable was not instigated by actions of the CM but from a bumbling COR..
            Last edited by moosetracker; 10-03-2013, 06:42 PM.

        • #7
          In the Commissioner Fieldbook for Unit Service, http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/33621.pdf, there is a chapter titled "How to Remove a Volunteer", it states:


          Who has the authority to remove a volunteer? A good rule of thumb is this: The person or group with the authority to appoint a volunteer has the authority to remove and replace that volunteer

          And goes on to state,


          In the case of unit Scouters, commissioners must remember that it is the chartered organization that has made the appointment.






          Comment


          • #8
            Have you already asked the CM to go? How about talking before firing. He or she might decide that if the Pack doesn't want him ro her that it's best to just leave. But I've also seen where a COR or the COmmittee asked the Council to ask the CM to step down.

            Comment


            • ChuckConnors
              ChuckConnors commented
              Editing a comment
              No discussion with CM. COR & CC goes to council with false info and statements. The rest is history.

            • ScoutNut
              ScoutNut commented
              Editing a comment
              As others have stated the buck stops at the Charter Organization.

              If the COR wants the CM gone, the CM is gone. There does not need to be any discussion, or voting. The CM is simply told by the COR his services are no longer needed.

              If the COR supports the CM, than no matter what the Committee, or any of the parents want, the CM stays.

              The only ones who can override a COR are the IH (Institutional Head of the Charter Org), and the Council Scout Exec (only for youth protection reasons).

          • #9
            You know, if you want some advice on how to resolve an issue between adult volunteers before initiating a converasation with the COR about removing a volunteer from their position and the unit (because that's often the effect in the end) there are members here with many moons of experience.

            But, yes, as others have said, the COR is the "decider" as to who the adult leadership of their pack/troop/etc is.

            Comment


            • #10
              You know, if you want some advice on how to resolve an issue between adult volunteers before initiating a converasation with the COR about removing a volunteer from their position and the unit (because that's often the effect in the end) there are members here with many moons of experience.

              But, yes, as others have said, the COR is the "decider" as to who the adult leadership of their pack/troop/etc is.

              Comment


              • #11
                Originally posted by ChuckConnors
                not too sure about that since Cubmaster precedes both COR and CC. If neither signed Cubmaste Application, how can he be removed by people who never had any say in his becoming Cubmaster in the first place?
                Who was there first has no relevance COR and IH may remove volunteers for any reason, or no reason at all. CC may recommend, but doesn't have the authority.

                Comment


                • #12
                  Originally posted by ChuckConnors
                  not too sure about that since Cubmaster precedes both COR and CC. If neither signed Cubmaste Application, how can he be removed by people who never had any say in his becoming Cubmaster in the first place?
                  Who was there first has no relevance COR and IH may remove volunteers for any reason, or no reason at all. CC may recommend, but doesn't have the authority to solely remove.

                  Comment


                  • #13
                    Originally posted by ChuckConnors
                    not too sure about that since Cubmaster precedes both COR and CC. If neither signed Cubmaste Application, how can he be removed by people who never had any say in his becoming Cubmaster in the first place?
                    Who was there first has no relevance COR and IH may remove volunteers for any reason, or no reason at all. CC may recommend, but doesn't have the authority to solely remove.

                    Comment


                    • #14
                      This happened to me. Believe me my Pack families tried to intervene or get the decision changed. The bottom line is the IH has the ability to do it unequivocally and normally the COR is the mouthpiece of said IH. The decision does not, unfortunately, need to go through the committee at all.

                      Comment


                      • #15
                        COR is a meddlesome fool without an original thought in his head. He is easily influenced by those who he believes to be his "friend" or concerned about what he considers to be his duties. He has caused more problems than he's helped and he made the final decision to remove the Cubmaster in mid-program year which caused the entire year to go down the drain. No one seems to remember that these issues affect the kids. Some adults can only see their own egos as their motivation for their actions. Horrible. What a waste. The Cubmaster was well-liked by parents and kids alike. It became nothing more than a show of force by the COR (with significant influence by his "friend" the Committee Chairman) who wanted nothing more than to be All-Things-Scouting and replace himself as the Cubmaster AND Committee Chair. About a third of our kids have abandoned our pack or scouts entirely as a result of this stupidity. Imagine going on a tent campout and ordering pizza for dinner, since the only person who had any cooking gear was the cubmaster. And he was the only person who did any of the legwork making sure things got done. Scouting is going into the toilet because the main purpose of the council leaders is to maintain the status quo, no matter how poorly it operates. Pathetic.

                        Comment


                        • alarab
                          alarab commented
                          Editing a comment
                          We have the same thing happening in our Pack right now!
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