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What changes would you make if you were Robert Gates, the new BSA president

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  • #16
    If you support the Uniform Method, there should be A uniform - as in uniform, not endless options that do not look alike, The sales folks desire to meet customer preferences have trumped the methods folks. All the rationales are inapplicable with noticeably different "uniforms" that vary in cost,

    Venturing awards are being addressed. There is suppposed to be a rollout at the annual meeting, along with new training material to correspond to that and other changes.

    I wonder if BSA did parent focus groups on gay adult leaders.
    Last edited by TAHAWK; 06-02-2014, 08:34 PM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by fred johnson View Post
      Eagledad .. In my view, this is not a political rant. I am really scared by BSA's coming 2015 changes that escalate the faith component. I am hoping Robert Gates can make big changes. Faith is very important to me, but forcing it more into the program is not a way to be successful.
      There absolutely no way to have a discussion on the 3 Gs without turning into a debate. Do you how many hundreds of posters said that adding gays would increase numbers. I believe I could make a few changes in the program that have nothing to do with the 3 Gs that would significantly improve numbers. Barry

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      • #18
        "KDD - No female leaders or the whole event is canceled. Welcome to the world of venturing... Personally, we've always been able to find female adults to come"

        That's interesting Fred. Our experience is quite the opposite. Our crew has had multiple events cancelled or the girls were only invited to come down for a day activity while the boys camped because we couldn't find female leadership for the overnight. The ladies also tend to have veto power on just about any activity that we try to do as a crew. It's all local I guess.

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        • #19
          Like he did as Secretary of Defense, Mr Gates needs to get in the field to talk and listen with the troops - scouts and us. .

          And if he could come in a Black Hawk copter that would be very cool.

          My $0.02

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          • #20
            Originally posted by scoutergipper View Post
            Girls would ruin Boy Scouts - I've polled the Scouts and they're 100 percent against it - most volunteered they'd leave if girls were let in. This is an Adult idea based on Adult concepts of "fairness" and other politically-correct nonsense..
            I think this is a bit narrow focused...... Personally, I abhor the word "Fair", but still, I like the idea of letting the girls in. So that aint it.
            Yes, I can imagine ways in which it could be bad...
            But I can also imagine ways in which it would be just fine. My thought is this. Separate dens for the girls at the cub level, separate patrols at the troop level. The patrols could even meet at different nights or places if necessary to keep things separate, coming together for only certain things. At the pack level, coming together pack meetings and trips.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by jumpyg View Post
              Shooting BB guns, rifles, shotguns?? What does that teach kids about violence?.


              absolutley nothing. nor does it promote violence.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by jumpyg View Post
                Shooting BB guns, rifles, shotguns?? What does that teach kids about violence?.


                absolutley nothing. nor does it promote violence.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by TAHAWK View Post
                  ...Venturing awards are being addressed. There is suppposed to be a rollout at the annual meeting, along with new training material to corrspond to that and other changes....
                  For anyone interested, the Venturing, Discovery, Pathfinder, and Summit awards are outlined in
                  http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pr...55_LowRes2.pdf.
                  Exactly what they'll look like is still to be determined.
                  <meta http-equiv="pragma" content="no-cache">
                  Last edited by qwazse; 05-23-2014, 03:46 PM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by blw2 View Post
                    I think this is a bit narrow focused...... Personally, I abhor the word &quot;Fair&quot;, but still, I like the idea of letting the girls in. So that aint it. Yes, I can imagine ways in which it could be bad... But I can also imagine ways in which it would be just fine. My thought is this. Separate dens for the girls at the cub level, separate patrols at the troop level. The patrols could even meet at different nights or places if necessary to keep things separate, coming together for only certain things. At the pack level, coming together pack meetings and trips.
                    Hmmm. Separate but Equal. That usually works out well. So what exactly would that accomplish?

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                    • #25
                      I know my suggestions would not be popular, but I would:

                      Increase the rigor of the requirements for Tenderfoot through First Class.

                      Prohibit the working on/earning of Merit Badges until the scout has earned First Class.

                      Prohibit the use of non-adults as Merit Badge counselors at summer camp.

                      Prohibit Large group Merit badge classes (MB universities/mills).

                      I also agree with limiting the focus on religion. There are many other aspects of the oath and law which are just as important IMO. I do not see why we give special attention to one of them. we don't have a special declaration "to keep myself physically fit", nor do we remove scouts who are not "mentally awake", etc...

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                      • #26
                        As a mom of only boys, I would have to beg for no to girls in the cub program. Young boys need the chance to 'run free as boys', play with sticks and rocks. They are tactile creatures and love to see cause and effect. When I was a Cub Scout leader I did my best to let them be little boys, as loud and messy and sometimes silly & gross as they could be. To explore and learn in hands on ways. In my part of the country, Public education has taken that away from them, everyone is expected to sit with hands folded and use quiet sweet voices all the time, not to show displeasure or heaven forbid get actually angry. Everyone gets a trophy for showing up. Little boys can still grow up to be sensitive and respectful young men if allowed to get some of this "foolery" out of their system with their peers (other boys) when they are youngsters. Adding girls will change the group dynamic. We used to hold a reptile pack meeting, one year invited brownies (helped share costs and many families requested). The boys didn't get a chance to ask many questions as the girls were a little more assertive, several seemed to get bored fast (acted naughty) & after that one den of parents asked we don't do that kind of shared event since their kids didn't have as much fun as the year before. I heard it from a single mom in the den a long time ago - she signed her son up so he could be with lots of boys his age to do boy things she had no clue about.

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                        • #27
                          DuctTape. Large group merit badge sessions can be well run, takes planning and counselors who don't let kids 'slide' through. There are several great merit badges that can be earned on the way to becoming First Class, several can be done at camp even. Electricity is one; so are Art, Disability Awareness, Music and Pet Care all great for new crossovers to work on

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                          • #28
                            ML has a point. And, looking empirically, which is BSA's fastest shrinking program? The co-ed one.

                            That said, boys and girls take a little getting used to each other. But only a little. And adult expectations will need to shift. When most of us talk about co-ed, we're thinking about inviting girls in to be part of that pioneer spirit that we are trying to engender in our boys ... not about the boys fitting in to another classroom-type setting.

                            For each point on our "If I were Bob" list, we need to think about what this country really needs. I personally think it needs 14-20 year olds experiencing physical challenges with both sexes helping each other through. Thus, I advise a co-ed crew. Some of my fellow advisors think that this nation needs 14-20 year olds doing the same thing without being burdened by the needs of the opposite sex, thus they advise unisex crews.

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                            • #29
                              Mr Gates' speech to the assembly last night.

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaBbrNN5iSU

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by King Ding Dong View Post
                                Letting girls in to the lower programs would be HUGE PR disaster without the full endorsement of GSUSA and that is not going to happen. On top of that we would just be inheriting their problems. Male leadership is going to take tween girls out in the woods without a female adult ? I don't think so. No female adult available? So the girls stay behind or the whole thing is cancelled? I don't think so.
                                They would have to use the same rules of YP as we currently use. At least one same sex adult has to be there for every gender present at the campout. If only boys, you need at least one male adult leader. If only girls, you need at least one female adult leader. If both are present, you need both a male and female adult leader. Fairly simple.

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