Looking for suggestions!

[jazzjeff 10]

I am looking for some advice on dealing with a difficult family. This scout has never participated in any service projects (scouting for food, caroling etc). He is very difficult in the den meetings due to disrespectful behaviors, whining, refusing to participate in activities etc.. Unfortunately, one of the issues is that the family record most of their activities being done in the home. An example of this is a scout whose parent has marked him having earned every single elective, belt loop/pin, specialty badges from last year. I was a den leader and spent countless hours having to audit his advancement reports, and I ended up being the bad guy because I refused to award him the nova awards, the leave no trace award and several others that had a share with the den requirement that weren't met. This year, as a web 1, she has marked the majority of the activity badges as complete..And it's only November!! I am beyond frustrated with this woman, and I feel so bad for my little scout because she has him believing he has earned all of these when that isn't true! Ugh, so here we go again this year..any suggestions on how to handle this? Thank you for any advice you may have.

[JoeBob 606]

When you have your "Come to Jesus!" meeting with this woman, do 2 things:

 

1- Let her know which Den activities she may NOT sign off. Circle or highlight them in the book.

2- Point out that she is not helping her child. When he moves up to a level where mommy can not sign off on anything, this scout will have no idea how to function. She is setting him up for failure.

[Sidney Porter 104]

Looking at the webelos handbook on page 14 paragraph 3. "the webelos den leader (or another adult the leader designates) signs or initials each requirement your son completes." This differs from the early ranks for comparison page 7 of the wolf handbook "When has a boy completed an elective or achievement? When he, in your opinion as Akela, has completed the skills to the best of his ability."

 

I interpret that has Webelos the den leader needs to authorize the parent to sign off, that differs from the other ranks. For loops* and pins I would probably not make an issue for for anything require for Webelos you could. *some loops are required.

 

This is part fo the transition period to boy scouts where the parents do not not sign off.

[LeCastor 641]

Welcome, Lisa!

 

I guess I would have a sit-down discussion with the mom and try to get an idea for why she is doing this. By calmly explaining the proper procedure for signing off on requirements, you will make your point known and set the ground rules moving forward. Then, in a Den meeting you could just briefly explain to the Webelos, as an aside, how you expect requirements to be signed off for the Den.

 

Sure, this is annoying behavior but you definitely shouldn't alienate the young Scout. It's amazing how much young people hear even when you don't think they're listening! As upset as this makes you, try to remain calm and collected while standing firm to the way you want to see things go.

[SeattlePioneer 144]

I'd seriously consider not registering the boy with the pack for another year, and to suspend them now until the end of the year. I wouldn't send the family to another pack, unless you are at swords point with a pack for some reason.

 

I don't believe in making Scouting unreasonably burdensome for volunteers, or keeping boys who are unable to keep the Cub Scout promise and law in some reasonable fashion.

 

The general rule is that one troublesome boy can drive five good boys out of Scouting.

[LeCastor 641]

I'd seriously consider not registering the boy with the pack for another year, and to suspend them now until the end of the year. I wouldn't send the family to another pack, unless you are at swords point with a pack for some reason.

 

Wow, that seems a little harsh there, Seattle! From the OP I kind of gathered that the mom was the one misleading this Cubbie. Is the youngster the one we want to punish?

[AKdenldr 33]

Lots of great ideas here Lisa. Below is roughly something I did with some success.

 

Do you have a den code of conduct that you developed with your webs? If not do that. As part of that, go over the web signature requirements with the boys.

 

I had some successes in the webelos years doing a "conference" with parent and scout (5-10 minutes). I would suggest that you have a conference with mom and scout.

 

Compliment the scout for something. Thank the mom for taking the time for the conference.

Go over the den code of conduct and the webelos sign off procedures (leave the past out of it)

ask if they understand and will abide by the code of conduct.

Ask the boy if he wants to continue in the den and earn his AOL or bridge to boyscouts

Then say something nice again about the boy, saying that you think he has the stuff to be a great young man or boy scout.

 

Thank them for their time, ask mom to stay for a bit and send boy on an out of room errand. Tell her that the web years are for preparing for Boy Scout troop (or increased independence of Junior High). Tell her that you don't think that he is yet getting the full benefit of the program because of lack of participation and his den behavior. Let her know that she will need to be present in monitoring her son's behavior if he does not meet up the code of conduct, and that might be as soon as the meeting after next. At that point if a parent can not be there, well you'll be sorry to lose scout from the den.

 

Update your CM with the details of what you did.

 

Post your den code of conduct at all meetings. Perhaps scan and send out in your parent communications.

 

Touch base with that parent after the next few meetings to let her know how scout did with his behavior.

 

I would then "conference" with other parent/scout sets throughout the year -- maybe just to talk about how scouts is going and any missing advancement pieces. A much more fun chat.

 

Best of luck to you. Scout is lucky to have you in his life.

 

[LeCastor 641]

 

Best of luck to you. Scout is lucky to have you in his life.

 

Yes! This right here.

[Faith 41]

I agree with a lot of the suggestions here. I would not send him away (I've had problematic scouts and problematic parents - when its the parents, I try my very best to keep the scout with us parents-willing and scout-wanting.) With that being said, I would sit down with the mom and talk it out, plain and simple. I try not to be an overly confrontational person but if I see a parent doing wrong repeatedly (which I have encountered, thankfully, only a few times) I want to get to the bottom of it. A few have eventually dropped out afterwards but some actually backed off and let their scout do their thing. Some told me just to go with it but who does that help? I also agree with the above two sentiments - they are lucky to have you

[SeattlePioneer 144]

Time will tell whether my suggestion to expel the boys was a good suggestion.

 

 

I'd be interested in getting updates on what is done and how it works out.

 

 

 

[jazzjeff 10]

Thank you for the suggestions! It is sometimes really good to get an objective point of view for things like this. We are having a leaders meeting tonight and I am going to run these ideas by everyone in anticipation of needing some support. As much as this scout and his family are disruptive I would never be able to to remove them from the den. I couldn't imagine how hurt the scout would be, I think that disappointment would be long lasting, so although it would make things MUCH better I don't think it's an option I could actually go through with. I have had other parents mention that to me as a possibility so, in the case that others do start quitting I would be forced to revisit this option I think. I am going to have a sit down with them and review the expectations for this year, including the new sign offs for webelos that need den leader approval and this is non negotiable. I am implementing a new code of conduct too, and will be sending scouts home after a verbal warning, and a time out fail to correct the behaviors. I do reward for good behavior too so I an not all doom and gloom though! She has had the audacity to complain that he never gets a good behavior award. I sometimes catch myself wondering how on earth some people actually got to be parents..that was not very scout like of me but I'm only human. I will keep you updated, thank you again for such a great resource!

[jazzjeff 10]

Sorry, that was my iPad typing and it did not keep my paragraphs. I know that is a pain in the butt read..

[Faith 41]

You used correct punctuation and let us know where one sentence ended and another began. That's more than some people on the internet do with no excuse All jokes aside, please let us know how it goes. Hoping for the best for y'all!

[Momleader 65]

This is a challenging case. We had a similar problem when I was a Wolf & Bear leader. Funny how a kid who missed close to 50% of den meetings & parents griped constantly about snacks, popcorn, & hikes, and didn't like us telling little Jonny to sit still when it was time. He managed to get signed off on more electives than everyone who came to meetings & outdoor activitys. A Scout is Trustworthy? mom didn't like us asking too many questions about if he had fun and did his best on the electives. We had a come to Jesus meeting the first Webelos meeting. Den chiefs players a game with the boys and leaders met with the parents. We explained that Webelos was getting the boys ready to be Boy Scouts. Just as a merit badge has several tasks that need to be learned and signed off on so did the Webelos pins & these were the pins that we as leaders would like the kids to work on at home with their parents and we would hold a 'mini meeting' with the boy to discuss what they did to complete the pin at home - sort of a practice session for meeting with merit badge counselors. It actually worked well. And we raked the parents to sign up and teach Webelos pins they have skill in. Our CO requested that aquanaut be done at cub camp (a child drowned ages - 40+ yrs - ago at a church outing at the nearby lake) we honored that request, some didn't earn it but they were given the opportunity including once during April school break. Our Jonny Earn-It-All struggled at first but came back and completed his AOL.

[fred johnson 936]

This topic is one of the reasons I am frustrated with on-line advancement tools. Especially those that parents can use to record advancement.

 

IMHO, I'd rather just use Excel and email the next set of advancements to the advancement coordinator. It stops the out-of-control parent.

 

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Focus on creating a great program for the rest of the Webelos.

 

Audit the "as a den" or similar requirements.