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parent/cub master going over my head

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  • parent/cub master going over my head

    I am a webelos leader. I have learned that I am supposed to be the one signing off on achievements. The boys can do stuff at home, but I need to go over it with them and sign them off. The cub master has a webelos son. I've never even seen his book. She sent the cub committee member the list of awards he's earned, but I haven't talked to him about them at all! He moves on to Boy scouts in January. Is this something I should even try changing now? Is there a diplomatic way of letting the cub master know that this is not okay and that I really need to talk to her son about achievements and have me be the one to sign him off?

  • #2
    In general, yes, you need to talk to the Cubmaster about going over your head. Even while though I was the Cubmaster, I would inform the WDL of what my son has done. And also have him tell the WDL and explain what took place. Generally it was work on Pins outside the Den/Pack Meetings. We supplied photographic evidence or other items as needed. Yes, there is a section within the Guide to Advancment that talks about this and the Webelos Book.

    This Mom will more than likely have a rude awakening within Boy Scouts since it's up to the Scout to talk to the SM about advancement (in general).


    • #3
      You're probably tempted to ignore the situation since the boy won't be your problem after January. But you have to consider the example that sets for the other boys in your den. They know what CM's child has and has not done...

      "Also, your Webelos Den Leader will now sign off your activities (your parent or guardian does not sign off the activities as they did when you were a Wolf or Bear)."


      • #4
        Pack meeting is this week. I think I'll make up a "Webelos Fact Sheet" to give to all the parents. (This parent isn't the only one confused- just the only one that has the power to tell the committee member what to buy.) Are there any already made fact sheets? I'd love to not have to reinvent the wheel.


        • ScoutNut
          ScoutNut commented
          Editing a comment
          I could not find any "Webelos Fact Sheets". However, what I did find was the Webelos Handbook. In the front of the Webelos Handbook is the "Webelos Scout Parent Guide". On pages 10-11 (in 2008 printing) is the section titled - "The Webelos Experience" which includes a bullet pointed list of the ways the Webelos program is different from the other Cub programs. This includes information on who signs off on a Webelos work.

      • #5
        Is it worth trying?
        If you don't like confrontation, it's not worth it.
        If you like helping a boy (and maybe parent) get the most out of scouting, it's probably worth it.

        I would ask the cubmaster point blank if there's anything I've done to not be worthy of the privilege of going over the boy's book with him.


        • christineka
          christineka commented
          Editing a comment
          The previous webelos leader didn't go over how the webelos program works. (She was very laid back about the program.) The parents assume it's very similar to wolves and bears, where they sign off their boy's achievements. The webelos book is so big that I don't think the other parents have bothered to read it. (I've gone through it about 10 times now and learn something new each time.)

      • #6
        Christineka: Thank you for taking on this truly awe inspiring role as WDL. You will be nothing but gratified in the end.
        By strict BSA standards, if you as the WDL haven't passed on the boy's pins/requirements etc., then he hasn't "earned" them. Perhaps the CM needs to be gently reminded of this. If the CM took the CLTraining, then this would have been mentioned!
        If you have gone over the book, then you have read the part that details WHO is responsible for the advancement checks. Especially if you are a new WDL, I would do the fact sheet thing, and refer to the "official" readings. If you have a schedule in mind (ages, topics for meetings, monthly advancement/pin goals, etc.) a good idea is to include that. Remind ALL the Webs about this requirement that the WDL is the person to OK the rank requirements, don't single out anyone, but make sure the Scout in question understands the importance of it. He will make the mom understand. You might still have to gently remind CMMom that . They may need to fufill some work at home, but you, the WDL, needs to be the one who finally reviews it to be correct .
        .I agree with Huey about the "rude awakening" when the boy becomes a BScout. This may be a EagleMom, if you know what I mean.


        • #7
          If I recall correctly this is the CM control freak and has a younger boy in two different packs as well, correct ? You can try and fight this battle with her and others have given good advise on how to do that. You also need to work with this person and need her to cooperate with you on certain issues. Her "bling fling" is primarily hurting her son and not yours, so I would be cautious in confronting her. Pick your battles. Her son will know he didn't earn the badges, your son will know he did.


          • christineka
            christineka commented
            Editing a comment
            No, the committee member is the control freak. There's no way I can go to her and tell her not to just go buy whatever awards the cub master says to get. I'd be railed on about how so and so is doing really awesome at her job and is going through a rough time, etc, etc.

            The cub master is a reasonable person. I think she's just misguided. Our webelos leader was doing nothing for 6 months and didn't do a whole lot before. I don't think she even read the manual- just went off worksheets and check lists.

          • qwazse
            qwazse commented
            Editing a comment
            I think you just answered your question. Reason with reasonable people. They may appreciate that someone else is not only making up for lost ground, but willing to help their boy succeed.

        • #8
          I'm sorry you're going through this. So far, some excellent advice has been given.
          My initial thought: Is this the Hill you wish to die on?
          While I certainly think the right thing to do is discuss this issue with the parents, and if you find no solution, bring it up to the Committee Chair...but as you explained, I don't expect a lot of resolution. You may need to decide if you can really effect a change at this point. With less than 6 months before cross-over...the young boy will learn more about what a parent can and can't sign off in 6 months after cross over.
          It's for this very reason, my former pack had a rule authorizing a Den Leader Conference. We allowed a parent to be present with the Cubmaster, however the parent would only be allowed to remind a boy of when he did an event, not what he did. (i.e. remember the 4th of July festival downtown...) This allowed issues like this to be dealt with...but we never had to actually do this.


          • #9
            If the parent likes to do things at home with the boy, you might give them these worksheets:
            That way he can bring you some proof that he actually did the required items.


            • #10
              do not give them worksheets. they'll go home and do webelos pins as if they are homework assignments which takes ALL the fun out of scouting.


              • dedkad
                dedkad commented
                Editing a comment
                I agree that Cub Scouts should not be like homework, which is why I detest some of the requirements they need to fulfill. However, as the program currently stands, the Webelos are encouraged to explore the handbook on their own because not too many dens can offer the boy a chance to earn every badge. This is one way the boy can take on that responsibility of learning on his own, like they would when getting started with a Boy Scout merit badge. Given the alternative of taking the parent's word for it or denying them their activity badge, I think the worksheet is a decent option.

              • christineka
                christineka commented
                Editing a comment
                I've been trying to talk with the boys individually (in the same room) during gathering. I ask about the achievements they supposedly completed. If they can tell me- "oh, yeah, I wrote so and so an email last week.", I'll count that. If they can't answer me- or their answer doesn't satisfy me, such as "which community leader did you visit with?" "uh... it was last year.... I don't remember", then I won't warm it completed. I have no reason to believe my webelos are dishonest- I just think the moms are marking stuff off without reading the whole achievement- or don't realize that what happened last year doesn't count.

              • King Ding Dong
                King Ding Dong commented
                Editing a comment
                That's what's great about Missouri. The boys are used to hearing "Show Me"