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  • Cubmaster stripped?

    I am a new Cubmaster. I have been with the Pack for 2 years in a leadership role, in that time I have done my required training and then some, I also have done a quite a bit of research, learned a lot from you folks. Thank You. My issue, a Leader in the Pack who has crossed over to Boy Scouts was the Committee Chair and Advancement Chair for 5 years and had assumed a majority of the Cubmasters responsibilities, leaving the Cubmaster to run the Pack meeting and set up the Packs Scouting program, with his approval of course. Now he is gone and I am the second Cubmaster since his crossing. Our Committee is stuck in a status quot, that I am only to be responsible for the 2 areas I mentioned above. I would appreciate youalls input on wich derection should take.

  • #2
    Is this a problem for you ? What other areas do you want to take over ? Preparing a good pack meeting and setting up the Packs program are important and time consuming responsibilities. I assume "the packs program" involves interacting with the other den leaders to help guide their program. Here is the long list of Cubmaster responsibilities. What is the Committee not allowing you to do ? http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/...ack/cmast.aspx

    Comment


    • ScoutNut
      ScoutNut commented
      Editing a comment
      Where does BSA state one of the Cubmaster's jobs is to "monitor" the den programs?

      In BSA's list of Cubmaster responsibilities (see KDD's link above), it states -

      - Plan and help carry out the Cub Scout program in the pack according to the policies of the BSA. This includes leading the monthly pack meeting, with the help of other leaders.

      - Work with the pack committee on program ideas

      - Guide and support den leaders

      It should not be necessary for a CM to "monitor" any den unless requested to do so by the den leaders, or because of some kind of major problem within a specific den.

      Tracking Scout participation at Pack, and/or den activities, should be the responsibility of the individual den leader, not the CM. Typically, the den leaders report all of their Scouts activity monthly to the Advancement Chair.

      When you state "working with the Advancement chair to be certain Scouts are getting their recognition" I am not sure what - exactly - you are referring to.

      Are you planning on monitoring the Advancement Chair to be sure that all reported advancements are purchased for the month? If so that is not the responsibility of the CM. The Advancement Chair is a Committee Member, and as such, they are part of the Committee Chair's responsibility.

      Do you mean that this is part of your "monitoring" of the den's programs? Do you plan on telling your den leaders who they need to give advancement to, and when? If so that is the den leaders responsibility, not the Cubmasters.

      A Committee Chair is not really "in charge" of a Pack. Per BSA, the Committee Chair is in charge of the Pack Committee, and is responsible for "the administration, oversight, and support of the pack program". The Cubmaster works with the Pack program itself, and the Scouts.

      The Committee Chair, Cubmaster, Committee, and other leaders, all work TOGETHER as a TEAM.

    • Woodward
      Woodward commented
      Editing a comment
      ScoutNut, I appreciate your input. The link KDD provided is a washed down version of whats in the Cub Scout Leader Book. I may be reading more into this than needed, that is why I came to youall. What is the norm in most Packs? I want to be an active Cubmaster. I did not volunteer for the position, but it was not forced on me.

    • ScoutNut
      ScoutNut commented
      Editing a comment
      Actually the list of Cubmaster responsibilities at KDD's link is - exactly - the same as the list in the 2010 Cub Scouts Leader Book.

      The "norm" in most Packs is for the Cubmaster to work with Scouts and program and the Committee to work with administration. The "norm" is also that folks do what they have to do when/if there are not enough volunteers to go around. Wearing multiple hats is usually the "norm" in many Packs, but that does not make the additional duties official Cubmaster responsibilities.

      As I said above, a unit (any unit) works better when all of it's leaders work together as a team. Adult infighting is the major cause of units folding.

  • #3
    What you describe sounds pretty much like the optimal Cubmaster role...just being the "program guy" and MC of meetings. Usually the complaint runs the other way around--the Cubmaster is expected to run the pack like a one-man show. I say be happy.

    Comment


    • Woodward
      Woodward commented
      Editing a comment
      This would be great if someone else took on the other responsibilities. When I brought the subject up of who will handle the other responsibilities the answer was a question Why?

    • ScoutNut
      ScoutNut commented
      Editing a comment
      You said you are the new Cubmaster, did they also get a new Committee Chair?

      The Committee Chair should be the one filling Committee Member positions.

  • #4
    Committee Chair and Advancement Chair, I'm guessing he also did Activities Chair, Fundraising Chair, Membership Chair, and all that other bullwork. None of which was the Cubmaster's responsibility, of course. And I'm guessing the real problem is everyone else thinks you are going to be doing everything now that you are "in charge".

    Start by breaking down the list of responsibilities. Then ask persons to step into defined roles. Don't "broadcast ask" for help, you will get none. Pull someone aside, ask them to do a specific job, with specific duties.

    Or is the problem what KDD mentions, that you actually have the role/duties of Cubmaster, but you don't quite get what those duties are supposed to be. From the description you gave, Pack Meetings and scouting program, that's what you should be doing.

    Comment


    • Woodward
      Woodward commented
      Editing a comment
      Your definition of scouting program must be different than ours has more to do with scheduling. The Committee Chair is "in charge" of the Pack

  • #5
    Woodward, have you taken position-specific training? If not, you should do so, right away. You seem to have a lot of confusion about the role of the Cubmaster.

    Comment


    • #6
      In our pack, the CMs are mostly a figurehead position. They will attend the pack planning meeting and give valuable input, but then it is up to the committee chair and committee people to make the events happen. We present the Cubmaster with a list of what is planned for each meeting, then the CM will come up with opening and closing remarks and act as MC at the meeting. They also are great sounding boards for den leaders who are struggling with parent or scout issues and need some support, advice, or just a pat on the back letting us know we are doing a good job. The CM doesn't necessarily have to be a hands-off leader, but they should not be a micromanager, particularly when it comes to the den programs. The den programs are the den leader's responsibilities and the CM should not get involved unless there are some problems. It's the nature of the CM position. Want to be a more active leader? Be a den leader or CC.

      Comment


      • #7
        I felt like I should chime in on this discussion, having been a cubmaster for almost 5 years. Yes, the den leaders report to the cubmaster. See the org chart:
        http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/...t/ThePack.aspx
        I do agree that the CM should not micro-manage the Den leaders, but rather be a guiding hand. Pick good people and let them do their thing, guide them if they are off course, but allow creativity. I have den leaders not using the den leader planning guide despite making sure it is known to them. It has even come to the point of almost losing a leader, when I pointed them back to the guide and they had the aha! moment. You can only lead them to the water...

        Also, in the committee chair responsibilities, you will see very little about dens other than suggesting when new dens should be formed.
        http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/...ack/pcomm.aspx

        "Guide and Support Den Leaders" in the cubmaster responsibilities is another supporting area that cubmasters should be active with the den leaders.

        Finally, in the Cub Scout Leaders Handbook, it states "The cubmaster is the guiding hand behind every other pack leader". I know I took this seriously when I became cubmaster.

        Some things I do with my den leaders:
        - Recruit new den leaders from parents
        - Guide new den leaders with the aid of the pack trainer. Offer my help to them to plan and run den meetings, especially the first meeting.
        - Prepare den leaders for upcoming years. I recommend den leaders get BALOO trained and Web Den leaders to get OWL trained. The latter is required to go webelos camping and we have a bi-monthly camping program as part of our web to scout transition.
        - Visit all the den meetings. The cubmaster is not always well known within the dens outside the pack meetings. Going to den viists allows you more personal time with the boys and the parents. I find most often that parents have a number of questions for me during the den meetings and it's great to get to know the parents better. Finally, what I like to call best practices. Each den runs differently. After visiting all my dens, I get to take the best of the best and suggest this to the den leaders as a best practice for their den meetings. in this way, all dens become stronger from the experiences of the den leaders. Ok, one more. I recently had a parent complain about their den leader not having information at the den meetings. Because I had been to that den leaders meetings, I was able to tell the parent that I knew that the leader had information readily available.
        Perhaps "monitor" is too strong a word. When I started den visits, some of the parents and leaders thought that I was trying to see what they were doing, but I assured them that this was not the case. Something that is grossly out of line would need to be addressed, but for the most part it's a way to get to know your parents and boys better. Looking at the responsibilities again, it is the cubmaster's responsibility to see that each boy receives a quality year-round program and attending den meetings will give you a better idea of the quality of that experience.

        Comment


        • #8
          t e
          Originally posted by Woodward View Post
          I am a new Cubmaster. I have been with the Pack for 2 years in a leadership role, in that time I have done my required training and then some, I also have done a quite a bit of research, learned a lot from you folks. Thank You. My issue, a Leader in the Pack who has crossed over to Boy Scouts was the Committee Chair and Advancement Chair for 5 years and had assumed a majority of the Cubmasters responsibilities, leaving the Cubmaster to run the Pack meeting and set up the Packs Scouting program, with his approval of course. Now he is gone and I am the second Cubmaster since his crossing. Our Committee is stuck in a status quot, that I am only to be responsible for the 2 areas I mentioned above. I would appreciate youalls input on wich derection should take.
          What else would you want to do? I think most Cubmasters would be envious. Is there something not being done, that you think a Pack should be doing?

          Comment


          • #9
            I'm the committee chair and a den leader. During den meeting nights, the CM opens the meeting (we do a joint opening then break into dens). During pack meeting nights, he directs the activity. During pack activities, he runs then if he's there, I run them if he's not there. The other den leaders jump in on activities because were used to running things. My in the background committee members help with some of the overall planning. A more active committee and Trainjng my replacement are near the top of the list. Den meetings are a time for you to gather notes and help share ideas between dens, plus a chance to chat with the parents. Plan more weekend activities, belt loop nights, etc if you feel under utilized.

            Comment


            • #10
              If more committees ran the pack like your pack Woodward, the Cub program would be in much better shape. I know at first it seems restrictivily departmental, but I'm sure you will be able to assist the other adults in those areas that are of interest to you. Trust and old scouter who has had to help fix some broken packs, yours is way way ahead in running a consistently strong program. Barry

              Comment


              • #11
                I don't see how you can "guide and support" the den programs if you don't monitor them... Cubmaster should be running activities for the boys when it's not den meeting times. That is a serious pack job. What else do you want to do?

                Comment

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