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Is BALOO required for pack campout ?


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I am in a pickle. I think I am the only person in the pack with BALOO and OWL. In my current Council they call it LOE (leader outdoor experience). I can't make the fall campout and can't find anything written that states that training is required, but it has always been my understanding that it is. There is a class before the campout so I hopefully I can get someone to step up. Is there a National Policy or is the policy governed at the Council level ?

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If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck it is a duck....   I'd get leaders Baloo trained, it is easy and file trip plans for each trip. It helps protect you for the just in case moment. I

And that's why registration fees keep climbing. We all are getting more pathetically dependent on pros for everything. Way to go entitlement generation!

Welcome to the forum!   First of all Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation training. - Contact your local Boy Scout troops. I'm sure there might be a SM or ASM who may have had that training or

See page 16 of the 2013 Guide to Safe Scouting upper right-hand corner:

 

"At least one adult on a pack overnighter must have

completed Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO,

No. 34162) to properly understand the importance of

program intent, Youth Protection policies, health and safety,

site selection, age-appropriate activities, and sufficient adult

participation. Permits for campouts shall be issued locally.

Packs use the tour and activity plan, No. 680-014."

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Thanks guys, I thought so. Just to make your head explode BD..... I don't think I have any lawyers in the pack, but in case I do.....one could read that sentence as "Baloo is required to properly understand the importance of program intent, Youth Protection policies, health and safety, site selection, age-appropriate activities, and sufficient adult participation. But we just want to camp and do not care about all that crap. It doesn't say we can't camp, we just won't properly understand the importance of....." :)

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Thanks guys, I thought so. Just to make your head explode BD..... I don't think I have any lawyers in the pack, but in case I do.....one could read that sentence as "Baloo is required to properly understand the importance of program intent, Youth Protection policies, health and safety, site selection, age-appropriate activities, and sufficient adult participation. But we just want to camp and do not care about all that crap. It doesn't say we can't camp, we just won't properly understand the importance of....." :)
BD you can put your head back together. I found this

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/510-631.pdf

 

"At least one adult giving leadership to a pack overnighter must complete Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO), No. 34162, and be present on campouts. "

 

Includes that helpful period before going on to explain why. :)

 

On the other hand, the Online GTSS is always supposed to be the most current and official document. :)

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Packs locally will not be issues tour permits without a baloo trained person. So what could happen if you don't have one.......nothing.... Your one of those guys that has to have it in writing. So exactly why sis you bother asking
I am looking for the stick to get some other leaders to go to training. Our council does not require tour permits if you stay in council. Looks like we are not camping on council property this fall, but even then the old CM never had to have BALOO to get a reservation for council property.

 

If I am going to stand up and insist that these leaders go to BALOO if they want to camp I darn well want to make sure I have the rules on my side and not be made a fool. The wishy washy BSA speak gets frustrating when two different documents talk about the same thing but use different sentences and are not explicit. Yes, I want it in writing. These are all legal rules "someone said" doesn't cut it.

 

That's why I am asking.

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Packs locally will not be issues tour permits without a baloo trained person. So what could happen if you don't have one.......nothing.... Your one of those guys that has to have it in writing. So exactly why sis you bother asking
So getting training because it is the right thing to do doesn't cut it???
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Packs locally will not be issues tour permits without a baloo trained person. So what could happen if you don't have one.......nothing.... Your one of those guys that has to have it in writing. So exactly why sis you bother asking
You know darn well it cuts it for me, I have listed all my training classes to you before. The other parents, not so much. I think there is only one other DL that has taken training beyond online. I don't have to deal with the same level of BS you do with parents, but general apathy, "I don't have time" yes.
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I've been trying for two years now to take BALOO, ever since I found out that our pack, like yours, is short of trained folks. Our district rarely does it, and the neighboring districts only do it during the school year when we are active with pack stuff. can't run the pack if we cancel events to get trained!

 

Regardless, other than trying to do right why does it matter? It's family camping. Jr is camping with mom and dad, not you. The pack just happens to be there too.....

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I took baloo out of council.......Our district does not offer training.....It really is a bad district.....The near by districts didn't match up schedule wise.....

 

It doesn't fit my schedule doesn't cut it in my book.....If it is important you will make time for it.......... Getting trained to take the Pack camping isn't important that fine. No camp out and yes the boys need to realize whose responsible.

 

Honestly it depends on how the Pack runs the camp out.....

 

Seen one pack where everyone is on their own for meals......Mine we cooked as a group.....Seen dens cook on their own......Seen parents run into town for chicken from walmart.

 

So KDD unless you put your foot down now with the CS parents their attitude will follow them into the Troop.....

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I've been trying for two years now to take BALOO, ever since I found out that our pack, like yours, is short of trained folks. Our district rarely does it, and the neighboring districts only do it during the school year when we are active with pack stuff. can't run the pack if we cancel events to get trained!

 

Regardless, other than trying to do right why does it matter? It's family camping. Jr is camping with mom and dad, not you. The pack just happens to be there too.....

I could take the attitude that since my family won't be there, so what? However, I am aslo IH and the ramification could be the Pack could not be covered under BSA insurance, exposing the CO to potential liability.

 

BALOO by itself is not even an overnight or at least wasn't when I took it. OWL required the overnight. Our council only offers it during the school year as well. Have someone else run the pack one Saturday.

 

Oh, and I wanted to add. My council doesn't offer BALOO as a stand alone course. I guess they have combined the two onto LOE (leader outdoor experience).

 

I never understood why BALOO with no overnight allowed you take the whole pack camping, but if JUST the Webelos wanted to camp as a den OWL with overnight was required.

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I've been trying for two years now to take BALOO, ever since I found out that our pack, like yours, is short of trained folks. Our district rarely does it, and the neighboring districts only do it during the school year when we are active with pack stuff. can't run the pack if we cancel events to get trained!

 

Regardless, other than trying to do right why does it matter? It's family camping. Jr is camping with mom and dad, not you. The pack just happens to be there too.....

OWL is not required to take a webelo den camping.....

 

A Webelos den leader who has completed position-specific training and Outdoor Leader Skills for Webelos Leaders training should conduct these events.

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/CubScouts/resources/CubScoutOutdoorProgramGuidelines.aspx

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I've been trying for two years now to take BALOO, ever since I found out that our pack, like yours, is short of trained folks. Our district rarely does it, and the neighboring districts only do it during the school year when we are active with pack stuff. can't run the pack if we cancel events to get trained!

 

Regardless, other than trying to do right why does it matter? It's family camping. Jr is camping with mom and dad, not you. The pack just happens to be there too.....

I think the way the rules and required training currently are completely ridiculous.......

 

I gotta live within the guidelines too......

 

 

So why do BSA guidelines and rules need to be a complete maze and open up discussions like this????

 

Require the training or not don't........Don't leave the decision up to the volunteers most will take the easy way out.

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