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my boy and completing achievements

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  • #16
    Just wondering - What is the EXACT BSA position held by the "Dictator"?

    Did the "Dictator" state that the 2 week chore chart MUST be made up of "household" chores (cleaning kitchen counter)?

    Bottom line - does the Webelos den leader, or your "Dictator", HAVE to accept only your word that your son has completed any Webelos requirements?

    Short answer - NO.

    Webelos is not Wolf, or Bear Cubs. Parents are no longer automatically allowed to sign off on any and all requirements. It is now the responsibility of the Webelos den leader to approve ALL WORK. The ONLY time a parent would be allowed to approve work done is if the Webelos den leader has given permission for parents to approve SPECIFIC requirements, and/or badges.

    So, YES, if the den leader, or in your case, ACTING, or ASSISTANT den leader ("Dictator"), requests that your SON provide documentation that he has completed certain requirements, it is well within their right to do so.

    Especially when you state your son did these requirements over one month ago, but they just started working on Handyman last week.

    Stop trying to find a "work around". Have your SON make up a chart showing what he did in the yard each day for those two weeks. Then the person who was supervising his efforts (you or your husband) can sign the chart stating he did the work listed. End of problem.

    You might have noticed I have stressed that your SON, do these things. Your son is no longer a Wolf, or Bear Cub. Webelos is a preparation for Boy Scouts, and as such the Scouts are expected to take charge of their own work. It is not up to YOU to provide any needed documentation, it is up to your SON.

    As for the belt loop, ask your Webelos den leader to talk to the Cubmaster, or the Pack Advancement Chair, to have the belt loop presented to your son.


    Comment


    • #17
      We do not have an advancement chair. We have: Cub Master (lady), Committee Member, Webelos' den leader, Bears' Den leader (myself), and Wolves' leader and 7 boys: 3 Webelos, 2 Bears, 2 Wolves. The committee member has been in for about 8 months. So far, she has taken control of the committee, the scouts, yelled at everyone for not doing their proper duty, headed up a fundraiser, which included breaking both church and bsa rules- when called on it by the bishop, she still continued with the improper activities, lied so that we won a pack award (gold status, which we don't meet the requirements for), and now has decided that she must make sure the boys complete her version of the requirements before they can earn the award. The Webelos' leader is still here and still working with the boys. She's just accepting help from the committee member.

      I do not see anything wrong with my son doing the work to earn all the activity badges. I've read all the requirements for everything multiple times now and it's not all easy stuff. He'll learn to become a better person by completing them.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by ScoutNut View Post
        Webelos is not Wolf, or Bear Cubs. Parents are no longer automatically allowed to sign off on any and all requirements. It is now the responsibility of the Webelos den leader to approve ALL WORK. The ONLY time a parent would be allowed to approve work done is if the Webelos den leader has given permission for parents to approve SPECIFIC requirements, and/or badges.

        So, YES, if the den leader, or in your case, ACTING, or ASSISTANT den leader ("Dictator"), requests that your SON provide documentation that he has completed certain requirements, it is well within their right to do so.

        Especially when you state your son did these requirements over one month ago, but they just started working on Handyman last week.

        Stop trying to find a "work around". Have your SON make up a chart showing what he did in the yard each day for those two weeks. Then the person who was supervising his efforts (you or your husband) can sign the chart stating he did the work listed. End of problem.
        I read that about how the webelos' leader has to sign off. That's why I tell her what my son has done, so she can sign off. He can't exactly care for the lawn at scout meeting. He started it a month ago, because that was when there was something to actually do. My husband is rather meticulous with his springtime lawn work, which makes lawn care extremely minimal for the rest of the year. I wanted my son to actually do a bunch of work rather than just go learn how the autoatic sprinkler system work. Family Member is full of stuff that cannot be done at scouts. The Webelos' leader has a routine in which she hands the boy a packet to go home and do at home for the badge. They just do stuff that have to be done as a den together. We were told we had to complete citizenship, fitness, and 1 badge of choice at home in order to earn Webelos. The leader also expects that the boys finish all the badges started at camp- at home. (Trying to find a scientist at work that we can go visit at work. The other boy just talked to his dad, an engineer at home and that was counted for the belt loop.)

        You make a point about the chart, I'll make him write up the stuff about the lawn and have my husband sign it. In future, I think I'll take photos or something of what he does at home. I don't know how him writing that he did such and such provides proof he did it, but if that's proper preparation to become a boy scout, I'll make him do that too. I don't know if my kid is the only lazy one in the world, but if I don't make him write down stuff, he won't. Perhaps if I make him now, he'll do it next year on his own.

        Comment


        • Basementdweller
          Basementdweller commented
          Editing a comment
          Your competely out of control regarding this situation.....you really need to read Vendi's post.....

      • #19
        BD, I have read all of the posts, hence the comments regarding the belt loop, readyman. and the committee person. I stand by opinion and appreciate the comments of the other members whose viewpoint differs from mine in this case. I also support her as a volunteer and appreciate her quest for knowledge of our program.
        Hopefully she filters the various suggestions and continues forward in her role as the Bear Den Leader. I do wonder why the Cubmaster and CC are MIA in this discussion




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        • #20
          EWD, I hope you experience a gal like this in your future......

          Comment


          • eaglewolfdad
            eaglewolfdad commented
            Editing a comment
            BD, LOL that is why I am so calm, I have had the pleasure of working with both Male and Female leaders with a variety of skill levels and can still smile about it

        • #21
          Originally posted by eaglewolfdad View Post
          I do wonder why the Cubmaster and CC are MIA in this discussion


          The cub master is brand new. She's also the bishop's wife and feels she must stay in a favorable position with everyone, so she doesn't get into stuff.

          Comment


          • eaglewolfdad
            eaglewolfdad commented
            Editing a comment
            A question for you. Are all of your leaders trained?

          • King Ding Dong
            King Ding Dong commented
            Editing a comment
            Even if they are, by whom?

        • #22
          Originally posted by Basementdweller View Post
          EWD, I hope you experience a gal like this in your future......
          I'm sure you'd much rather deal with our cub committee member instead.

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          • #23
            Rabid parent, no thanks....

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            • #24
              I really do not mean to knock LDS, but when I ever hear about a "bishop" I am always reminded about the guy who drives the truck and calls himself a "Sanitation Engineer". Christinaka, you and your son are "doing your best" under poor leadership. I would welcome you in my Pack and Troop with open arms.

              Comment


              • #25
                No, our leaders have not been trained. I did all the online training (leader specific, youth protection, fast start, and even the LDS scout training) the evening I was put into the position. I have brought up training with the rest of the leaders several times. They admit they haven't even done as much as the youth protection training. I brought it up with the bishop and he claimed he thought it was very important, but I have yet to see anything done about it. I work a lot with the wolf leader, seeing as how she's too spacey to plan anything, so we do bears and wolves together and we do talk a lot. (I've been trying to get her to help out a bit more and make decisions.) She knows she should do the training and that it's really easy, but she really doesn't get around to doing much on her own.

                Comment


                • eaglewolfdad
                  eaglewolfdad commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Triple Yikes!!! Lots of exposure here for a bunch of people. Safety of the boys is paramount. COR needs to ensure all of the leaders have YPT as a minimum

                • jc2008
                  jc2008 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  YPT is for more than just the boys safety. Its also about the adults safety and the liability risks of your organization/BSA.
                  I mean one of the key things is the 2 deep leadership. You are never alone with a boy.
                  People without training seem to believe that this is so no one abuses the boy or does anything improper. But the other side of the coin is so that the kid can't say "So and so did this to me!" and there is no second adult around to say, "That didn't happen".

                  If a kid claims abuse, you tend to err on the side of the child for safety reasons rather than the adult.

              • #26
                Originally posted by King Ding Dong View Post
                Christinaka, you and your son are "doing your best" under poor leadership.
                I do understand that the way LDS scouts are run are often sub-par compared to the regular scouts. Not only are the boys automatically signed up for scouts, whether it's the family's decision to join or not, but the leaders are all volunteerED, rather than volunteering themselves. My dad got into scouting when my older brother was a cub scout. He's still a scouter and goes to a bunch of camps to cook. I went to a live scout training back in the day when the internet was not quite as much as it is now. There are some fantastic scout leaders out there- because their motivation comes from within. I wish I was as enthusiastic. I do want to do my best as a leader and as a parent, but honestly, I would not have volunteered for this position if it were up to me. I feel very overwhelmed.

                Comment


                • #27
                  Thanks for letting me see things more calmly. I'll make my son label his rock collection and bring it to pack meeting. I also figure checking my oil and tire pressure every day for two weeks will be beneficial to both him and myself. (Me- so I know the levels are okay and him so hopefully after so much checking, he'll do it when he has a car to care for.)

                  Comment


                  • blw2
                    blw2 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Honestly, from skimming this thread, I'd say that's the best attitude to take.....
                    I do however think that you can live happy by feeling that your initial thoughts were correct..... perhaps just not the most cheerful approach....
                    I think many were busting your chops a little hard, since it's clear that they are trying to make up rules and are apparently not even trained.
                    In the end though, if you can teach your boy to cheerfully comply since it's not such a big deal and certainly not going to hurt either of you in any way.....it will be good lesson in going with the flow and reducing stress and friction.

                • #28
                  Glad you are taking a positive attitude towards this whole thing. I have seen Dens fail and fall apart because the Den Leader has a life event happen and are no longer to effectively do meetings etc. You are lucky that you had this woman, however annoying she is, step in and take over to make sure your Den is still going.

                  She might have more stringent standards than you would or your leader would, but they are not unreasonable. They are just more strict and closer to the textbook.

                  Look at the positive things she is doing for your Den (ie her time and effort in actually caring that the boys are doing the awards correctly and making sure your den doesn't fall apart).

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Glad you are taking a positive attitude towards this whole thing. I have seen Dens fail and fall apart because the Den Leader has a life event happen and are no longer to effectively do meetings etc. You are lucky that you had this woman, however annoying she is, step in and take over to make sure your Den is still going.

                    She might have more stringent standards than you would or your leader would, but they are not unreasonable. They are just more strict and closer to the textbook.

                    Look at the positive things she is doing for your Den (ie her time and effort in actually caring that the boys are doing the awards correctly and making sure your den doesn't fall apart).

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Christineka, I haven't read through the whole thread and I apologize for that. But so far my exception to your stance is simply that YOU are not to be handling this... it's your boy who needs to present the evidence as it were.

                      Comment

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