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Vipers!! (update on my sitch)

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  • #31
    Actually (with the approval of the COR and the CO), the CC DOES indeed have the ability to "fire" (and hire) leaders.

    The Scout Exec (other than a problem with youth protection or the background check), Commissioners, and all other council/district level folks, "higher up" or not, have nothing at all to say about who is, and is not, a leader in any specific unit.

    You need to contact your Pastor and the COR and have a bit of a face-to-face with them RIGHT NOW.


    • #32
      ScoutNut, that's the thing. That's kind of why the Wolf DL went to the Pastor and the Rep ~before~ the whole disciplinary thing went down. Because she felt that this gal was gunning for everyone who didn't agree with her procedures. The Pastor and the Rep *don't* support her.

      Based on what I told the two men, and what the WDL told them, AND the reputation that preceded this CC, the Rep met with the UC, and the Exec. Both of them assured him 1) that this gal HAS caused strife elsewhere in the District, and 2) that Council is aware of me working in a "challenged" area, that I have a good reputation and am well-liked.

      So last week the Rep told me that he and the Pastor agree that these 3 gals need to move along. However, because we're in the throes of planning Blue and Gold, and because the CC has 4 Webs that she brought with her and they'll want their ceremony with their Den leader. We didn't want to take that away from them.

      The plan is to date the 3 "thanks and goodbye" letters the day after the Banquet, and the Rep, Pastor, and UC will call a meeting with the 3 ladies and tell them that the church is going to step in, being the local body, etc, etc...

      17 days. I just have to smile and nod for 17 more days.


      • #33
        Oh! P.S.

        Last night there was a Committee meeting to plan Blue & Gold. The Scoutmaster had asked me to let him know when that meeting was to be, since we share the event of course, and we have a Web2 bridging over.

        The SM wanted to know what the plan was, how long he'd have to do his Court of Honor, were the Boy Scouts doing the Flag, or Cubs, or both? Did his parents need to do anything to help? What?

        So of course when I found out when the meeting was, I told him, and he attended. Why should he not, even if we weren't planning B&G? I find it perfectly natural for the same-Charter SM to visit the Pack Committee once in a while. Shouldn't they be connected, at least informally?

        Anyway, I got an email this morning from the CC, asking me "What did I know" about the SM being at the meeting. What did I know? What does that mean? I emailed back saying exactly what I said above; that he wanted to know what the plan was for B&G, so that he'd know what to expect, and I'd told him that this would be discussed at that Committee meeting.

        I got an email back saying, "I need you to call me."

        I am really, really praying that this doesn't get ugly, but I will not argue over whether I "should" have told the SM he was welcome at our Pack Comm meeting. He is welcome, just as ANY Scouter in the same Charter should be, as well as any church/Charter staff member, for that matter.

        I wasn't aware that Committee meetings were ever "closed".

        17 days... 17 days... 17 days... 17 days... 17 days...


        • #34
          What was the line from "War Games"? "The only way to win is never play"?

          Don't call. If she calls you, simply tell her you really "don't need to discuss the hows and whys of the SM attending the meeting. Is there anything else?"

          If it gets ugly, make sure you're in the ladies room.


          • #35
            Good point. I promised the UC and the Rep that I'd not say anything out loud to anybody or about anybody until it was settled.

            I will probably just hedge and say that we have Kid Choir from 5:15 to 6:45, then church til 8:30, etc etc...

            "If I can't see you, you don't exist. La la la la la..." ;0)


            • #36
              Good for you Ann! I've worked with some real winners over the years, and your situation is not unique. Sounds like your CC feels "threatened" by the presence of "outsiders" at "her" meeting. Keep counting down the days!



              • #37
                Curious 17 more days till What?????


                • #38
                  Until the 3 gals are notified by the CORep and the Pastor that their services will no longer be required.

                  16 days... 16 days... 16 days...


                  • #39
                    If, in 16 days, there's a spectacular astral lights display seen far and wide, I think I'll know that your 3 gals got their notice and went kablooey on the pack! (seriously, keep your cool, be somewhat unavailable for the next 3 weeks, and expect fireworks in 16 days)


                    • #40
                      HAHahahahah! Yep! Watch the southern sky!

                      I declined to call the CC last night, citing Kid Choir and Wed night church duties. Tonight, she has a Den meeting, and I'm ... um ... I dunno yet.

                      Tomorrow is my church's Ladies' Retreat. I didn't say I was GOING; I just said, "The 10th-11th is my church's Ladies' Retreat."

                      I will HAVE to see her on Sunday (Methodists are always a week late on Scout Sunday -- never have figured that out). Not sure how I'll escape her after that. Maybe she won't stay for services after the ceremony.

                      Monday night her henchhen will be at my Den meeting, showing my Bears what they'll be doing at the Banquet. She's got some ceremony she wants them to do. I have been left in the dark about it. The CC just "decreed" that this that & the other ceremonies would take place, and she and her 2 minions are "handling" it.

                      Monday will be a lot of smiling and nodding. This #2 gal is very pushy, herself. I'm not thrilled with the idea of being a captive audience ... at my own house, no less. Ugh.

                      Then 12 days to lay low until the B&G on the 25th.


                      • #41
                        I don't have TV service here in Germany, so I check in on these threads instead.

                        "Like sands through the hour glass, these are the days of our lives."


                        • #42
                          15 1/2 more days... 15 1/2 more days... 15 1/2 more days...



                          • #43

                            The short answer to "How'd it go?" is: It would have gone a lot more smoothly if the CC had let people other than her 2 henchhens be involved in the planning. However, B&G WAS accomplished, and it was fine.

                            The long answer:

                            Had I reported about the time issue? It was a big brouhahah; the CC sent out an Agenda for B&G that had the actual program lasting from 12:00 to 3:30. Not even kidding. That did not include set-up or clean-up.

                            The Trustee Chair of the church called me and said, "When will you be done? We have some A/V training that afternoon." I told him the clean-up was slated to go until 4:30. He said, "'re getting in there at 9:00. Surely you can be done in 6 hours?" I forwarded that to the CC, and she replied to the Trustee Chair that basically he could pound sand.

                            She didn't realize with whom she was dealing; the TC outranks even the pastor. He called our CORep and said, "I don't like her. 6 hours is enough. Have them out by 3:00." So the CORep emailed the CC and said, "You know, 3 1/2 hours is really pushing peoples' attention. Can we scale this back any?"

                            She pretty much told HIM to pound sand, as well, but he insisted that the program be cut back to 3:00. Her response? She called everyone and moved the start time to 11:00 so that she'd still have a 3 1/2 hour program.

                            That being said, Friday night during set up, OH the grumbling about the time issue (why???). What gobsmacked me was when she said, "But I am NOT cutting ANY of the Opening Ceremony! I have spent over $200 on JUST THAT, so we are DOING IT!"

                            Wait. What? $200 on JUST the Opening? For 16 Cubs? Some of you I'm sure know the ceremony: Akela tells 2 braves to go capture the blue of the sky and the gold of the sun. That's why Cub Scout colors are blue and gold.

                            Why $200? Because she bought a fake campfire and 3 complete Indian costumes. Um... we could have FAKED the campfire, and I could have BORROWED Indian costumes from the local community theatre. But I was excluded from the planning.

                            The funny thing is that even if we'd started at 12:00, we would have had plenty of time to do EVERYTHING she wanted to, IF she'd allowed me to run the platform (which is kind of the CM's JOB). But no, it was the "Hi! I'm your CC!" variety show.

                            And the Awards were COMPLETELY mixed up (that was the other gal's doing). One poor kid had been missing stuff for MONTHS with excuse after excuse, and he finally got everything, BUT HIS NAME IS "BOB", NOT ~BILL~. His name was wrong on EVERY award.

                            Also, another kid seems to ALWAYS be the one she shorts when she "only has 2" of something. His grandma heard her telling the kid, "I'll get it to you," and she said, "WHY is it always MY kid?" And she had a point. Why always him?

                            She was upset enough that the CC had to come join the conversation with the grandma and the henchhen. I was doing my best to schmooze the room while it was going on, but I overheard both the CC and the Awards hen bawk bawk bawking about how it was the DL's fault, it was the ScoutShop's fault, it was ScoutTrack's fault. Blah, blah.

                            What they don't seem to understand is that a simple (sincere!) "Oh, my gosh! I am SO sorry! I will order it the moment I get home!" But they both copped HUGE attitudes with these parents, and it was really, really ugly.

                            The ~idea~ I think she was going for, for the Banquet ... I get it! I do! She seems to have this UberBanquet in her head that she wants to see happen, and there's no room for deviation.

                            But you have to allow for some flexibility. And she SHOULD have let me in on the planning process (but you can't tell this gal anything). I have attended roughly 4,793 church potlucks in my life, and I'm here to tell you that you MUST create STATIONS! You CANNOT have one ONE-sided line shuffling along, while EVERY person struggles with the freakin' croutons!

                            If I had been ALLOWED any input, I could have set up the service to go at least twice as quickly. I know that kitchen, and I know that facility. There was NO reason the meal line should have taken the tortuous amount of time that it did. But she INSISTED that it be done like that.

                            I know it sounds like it was a disaster, but it was "fine". I just know that it could have been better, and there was NO reason for the CC to create rancor with the Trustee Chair and the CORep.

                            That was unnecessary. But it did strengthen the CORep's resolve to get rid of them. I sent a de-briefing email to him and the pastor, but I haven't heard back WHEN exactly they're going to dismiss them. I think they're trying to figure out whom to name as CC in this gal's place.

                            But it IS going to happen!


                            • #44
                              P.S. There is much gnashing between the SM and this Cub CC gal. We (Cubs) have RARELY (if ever) used the Scout Hut for anything, since I've been CM (or the 3 years before that, for that matter).

                              The ONLY reason I had a key, and the ONLY reason we ever went in there was to get the co-owned camping equipment out, and to put it back. That's it.

                              The Troop, however, meets there once a week, and always has. So they've always footed the utility bill, and the CO pays the taxes on the property.

                              However, the CC was using the Hut once a week, TOO, for a Webs meeting, which is FINE. That's what the Hut is FOR. But it's effectively doubled the utility bill. Obviously. Two nights a week is twice what one night a week costs.

                              The Troop paid it themselves from Sept through Jan, but now the SM has asked that the Pack pay half. AND THAT'S TOTALLY REASONABLE.

                              But, Ohhhhhhhhh! The grousing, the grumbling! "The Troop is 'shaking us down' for money!" They're asking us to pay our share for OUR USE.

                              I just don't understand some people.


                              • #45
                                I just couldn't imagine saying anything to a church trustee except thank you.

                                I wonder if CC asked the SM if she could meet in the building????